Fria Ligans forum

Regarding armor, I really dislike the new rules for several reasons. (However, just to be upfront, I don't have any real suggestions, primarily because I just don't understand what was wrong with what we had, possibly because I haven't done a lot of vehicular combat, and when I have I've exercised a lot of what I consider to be common sense.)

First, as many people have observed, the extreme compression of armor values is basically nonsensical, both in equipment and in xenomorphs.

Second, there's just no room in the current system for destruction by acid splash, which -- while minor -- is such a stressful, evocative, part of ALIEN lore.

Third, my tables have always enjoyed armor rolls. I don't get why these tense, exciting rolls were removed.

Regarding injury, my group likes the original table. (Admittedly, if a given injury seemed impossible to explain in the context of what happened, we'd roll again.)

In a game that uses so many tables -- but also has such clear, easy-to-read, understandable tables -- why not just have a few different critical hit (or serious injury, or whatever) tables? Non-lethal, bludgeoning, puncturing, severing, just off the top of my head. The table can be referenced (e.g., in xenomorph signature attacks) and/or it can be a matter of GM's discretion.

(I also advocate strongly for separate stress/panic tables for different activities. When it comes to an RPG, tables are just about the best and fastest way to reference information. Why not lean into ALIEN's use of them?)

Well, armor rolls have been mostly replaced by ‘defend’ and ‘dodge’ rolls. That part doesn’t bother me too much TBH. The ‘block’ mechanic was rarely used in the previous edition anyways, precisely because you had free armor rolls, so it’s nice to have a little more incentive to use that option.

Armor now is a flat damage reduction which overall, speeds the game. I don’t mind that change either. With a little more tweaking and fine-tunning, it should be ok.

They clearly drew a line with lethal and non-lethal injuries. If you manage to survive the incapacitation stage, your reward should be precisely SURVIVING, not dying just a few minutes later from a lethal injury. As before, most Xenos already have an insta-death attack. It doesn’t really matter exactly how you are killed, so feel free to rip limbs and maim to your liking. And if you die by death rolls, also feel free to inflict whatever gruesome and gore-ish wounds you prefer on you characters.

Acid splash still destroys armor, in fact, armor can save you from a minor splash or reduce damage from a larger one. You will lose your armor in the process, but it seems more accurate with the lore. (For example, Hicks’ armor was completely destroyed by a single splash, and Drake was directly killed by another single splash). Either you have luck avoiding the molecular acid or not. No mid terms.

I (and my gaming group) are huge fan of static armor values. It both avoids absurd extreme results, speeds up the game, and allows for some level of comfort and immersion in that armor will always do something positive (much like a weapon).

We are not fans of the extreme compression and think you can effectively have most of the armor between levels 1 and 2 (with maybe a single, expensive high end level 3 armor). To be brief, there is a nice middle ground here where we can have static values without 90% of armors being a value of 1.

We had implemented house rules in first edition that basically made armor a static value = Dice / 3 (round normally). Personal preference here but it worked really well.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Im3B8e ... sp=sharing

Agreed, I like the static values, just not the excessive compression.

What I'll probably end up doing is: something like a lightweight kevlar vest is Armor 1, military armor/riot armor is 2, super heavy space "assault armor" is 3, something like an armored combat mech suit that sometimes showed up in the games/comics would be 4.

The xenomorphs would get upgraded to to 3 for warriors, 4 for queens/praetorians, 5 for crushers.

 
But then, you'd also have to increase Xenomorph's damage. As it is, even with armor 1, you have a good chance of shruging off many of the 'standard' xeno attacks, and small arms' bullets. If you up the value to 2, you'll notice that suddendly, attacks short of military weapons have practically no effect on you.

I think the true problem lies in that many people like to have a complete guide of granular armors, a complete armory of weapons, each of them with small quirks or statistical differences to choose from. That sentiment is OK, However, I don't think ALIEN in its conception was a game in which equipment had that 'main' role. Equipment in Alien is more 'Abstract'. If we were for real in the alien universe, you'd have hundreds of pistol models to choose from. In the game, you only need 'a pistol'... or 'a flamethrower' the exact model or characteristics are not so relevant for the game. The same with armors, anything personal and comfortable is 'Armor 1'... it doesn't really matter if it has a helmet, or if it covers your limbs... It's an abstraction, because the game is more centered about narrative and decisions, rather than equipment. Sure, you still have some variety, but each instance is more a 'representative' of a category of weapons/armors, rather than specific models. For example, you only have a single sniper rifle in the game, which in fact, represents 'all sniper rifles', where in reality there would be dozens if not hundreds of different models, calibers etc etc.

Thus, a humble kevlar vest has armor 1, which represents that if offers 'protection against damage' in abstract, general terms, rather than the exact degree of protection. A complete EVA suit also confers 'damage protection' but complements it with some other gadgets, like lights or life support.

In other games, like D&D, equipment is more granular and defined, with dozens of weapons, armors and loads of magic items to choose from. That's OK, because the game's mechanic allows for it, and because finding rare, exotic objects has been always a trope in medieval fantasy games.

That's a very fair point - the system does not require or benefit from extreme granularity. It's only that there's a certain amount of iconic, named gear in the franchise we even get the equipment section designed the way it is.

That being said, I'd probably also upgrade the xenomorph attack damage if I boosted armor values, I don't mind them being extremely dangerous.

Part of it is just obsessiveness to the lore of the game, I think. For example, the M42A Sniper Rifle was introduced in the Colonial Marines Technical Manual, where it fires the heavy cartridge used by the smartgun and therefore I think it should do 3 base damage and not 2.

Out of curiosity, does almost everybody responding play/prefer military/marine-focused games, where everybody has armor?

"A stand-up fight" is the area of ALIEN that least interests me (don't get me wrong, I still love Aliens!), and it makes me wonder if maybe that's what leads to my rules preferences.

Speaking for myself, not particularly, I run adventures for marines, space truckers and colonists indistinctly.

But almost all Xenos have armor, so it’s a rule enforced in almost every game. And even in ‘human only’ adventures, usually someone has a Kevlar vest or weapons like shotguns or pistols that deal with armor.