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thelordwinter
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Mon 06 Feb 2023, 19:27

Big fan of the change from Motivations to Weaknesses, and tying those into Advancement and potentially overcoming the Weakness! I feel like that could lead to some really fun roleplaying moments.

Echoing some other posters, I'd love to see the Halfling and Dwarf Kin abilities modified to be similar to the Wolfkin where there is both an in and out of combat usage. Perhaps the Dwarf's ability can be expanded to those who have harmed or wronged you in the past. I also like another the idea of halflings getting a boon to use Sneaking if they are in small or hard to reach places. So a halfling sneaking through a manor might choose to hide in some cabinets or in a crate rather than just in the shadows.
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Bob Fish
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Joined: Mon 06 Feb 2023, 18:58

Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Mon 06 Feb 2023, 19:32

I think it's contradictory to say that acquiring heroic abilities should be a rare event, and then add "never more than once per standard-length adventure". What for many will mean: 1 heroic ability per adventure. And one heroic ability per adventure is too much. This "rare grand heroic deed" should be much tighter and better explained.

I general, I would prefer the game to have an experience curve typical of a BRP game (not the typical D&D zero to hero). Much flatter and more controlled (which is also better for the novice master to whom the game is partly aimed). BRP games do not stand out for their feats and combos, but for a down-to-earth "heroic realism" that allows us to tell more relatable stories without the need of going over the top. The characters get better with time, but they never become fantasy superheroes.

I think it's essential to keep that spirit of BRP games like the original Drakar och Demoner.
 
Bob Fish
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Mon 06 Feb 2023, 19:45

Hello!
This is more of a suggestion than anything else, but I feel like some of the kin abilities could benefit from being phrased in a way that made them less combat-centric, in that it would communicate better that this is not just a game centered around combat before everything else.
I'm thinking in particular about the Dwarves ability, which could maybe be rephrased to not be just about damage and game mechanics, but also about other slights and offenses they may have done. Similarly the halfling ability could perhaps also include wiggling free of restraints or through tight passages.
Agreed!

I think the origin of the problem is that Dragonbane was originally going to be a laser focused game eminently about fantasy combat, the complaints from Drakar och Demoner old players led Free League to add a good number of abilities (thankfully) so that it could be played beyond just that. But even though the new abilities have been included, the bulk of the game is still not fully geared towards a freer and wider game mode, where combat is still the most common option, but not the only one.

Your suggestion would be a step in that direction.
Last edited by Bob Fish on Mon 06 Feb 2023, 20:23, edited 1 time in total.
 
zcthu3
Posts: 121
Joined: Wed 29 May 2019, 10:34

Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Mon 06 Feb 2023, 20:01

Magic schools are now Heroic Abilities (Chapter 3 "Magic School'). Chapter 2 p.26 states:

Mages: If you play a mage, you don’t get any heroic ability
at the start of the game – your magic will make up for that
disadvantage! You can earn new heroic abilities during
play just like other professions, however.

Which is now incorrect since Mages do get an HA, it is just automatically 'Magical School' for their chosen school of magic.

p.19 (Mage Profession description) also states similar, which is incorrect as per above.

"Recommended Heroic Abilities: As a mage, you
don’t get a starting heroic ability. Instead, you get
your magic."
The Mage ability is not the same as the Magic School ability available to all characters after character creation. Mages start with a trained magic school (I.e. double the base chance) and several spells at character creation. The Magic School heroic ability gives a magic school at the base chance and no spells (I might give some magic tricks) which need to be learned separately.
 
Aegypto
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Joined: Tue 07 Feb 2023, 19:34

Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Tue 07 Feb 2023, 19:57

Hello everybody,

I'm probably in the minority here, but I'm not a fan of suppressing Motivations in favour of Weaknesses.

To provide an example, the past month I created five Dragonbane characters for a character creation challenge in RPGNet. Their backgrounds were entirely suggested to me by the results I got rolling in the Motivations table. Some of them I would not have thought by myself, not without the Motivation prompt, and I think the characters would have been less interesting as a result.

I'm fine with the existence of Weaknesses - I think they can encourage roleplay by providing mechanical benefits, but I would not get rid of the Motivations table - even if devoid of mechanical effects, it may be a helpful tool to develop character background and plot hooks.

My random 2 cents.
 
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Mcgibs
Posts: 29
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Tue 07 Feb 2023, 21:38

I agree, I think motivation tables could be in the same sort of fluff as names and appearances. It's not mechanically relevant anymore (I do really like the use of weaknesses for gaining experience), but it's a fun thing to think about with your character.
 
Gimkin
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun 05 Feb 2023, 19:47

Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Tue 07 Feb 2023, 22:03

I think there is no difference between Weakness and Motivation. Beeing greedy or doing everything for glitter and gold is just the same. Beeing positiv I would favor the wording Motivation over Weakness.
 
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Short Fey
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Tue 07 Feb 2023, 22:07

I think there is no difference between Weakness and Motivation. Beeing greedy or doing everything for glitter and gold is just the same. Beeing positiv I would favor the wording Motivation over Weakness.
I think it is easier for the sake of roleplay. When i ran the game with motivation, the players felt a bit unsure what "counts" as leaning into your motivation, especially if it wasn't something that was clear. Weakness comes out much clearer and i feel leads to more interesting roleplay sense your actively leaning into more detrimental situations.
Beware the fey!
 
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Garmr
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Tue 07 Feb 2023, 23:34

I agree on the motivations, maybe the table could be kept as an appendix or something while keeping weaknesses in the spotlight as they are now.
The motivations table is just really good, and I perfectly agree that they provide much better inspiration for character concepts than weaknesses. Motivation is a very strong force within the character to define, in the context of the adventure, who they are, how they act and why are they there in the first place. Conversely, a weakness is a secundary trait that is meant to get in their way sometimes, rather than drive that, and it's not as strong as a core concept to build a character around.
I for sure plan to keep a printed copy of the motivations chart in my handbook when I get it, but I do think that it would be helpful to keep it in in general, as an optional appendix maybe, if there's room for it.
 
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Short Fey
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 2 Your Character

Wed 08 Feb 2023, 00:16

I don't see any reason to not use both.

You can have Motivation as a way to give depth to your character as a bit of flavor, then have Weakness that can encourage more compelling rp and taking risks, and award you with advancements marks for doing so.
Beware the fey!

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