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zcthu3
Posts: 121
Joined: Wed 29 May 2019, 10:34

Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Tue 03 Jan 2023, 21:01

Reaction rolls are explained in the combat section, the only place it is used and sure you could call it a special variant of the standard opposing roll rule.
Except you just said they’re a variant of the opposing roll rule - which they’re not. They don’t resemble the Opposing Roll rules at all. They’re a standard skill check made in reaction to a successful attack. They are their own thing which is why I suggest that it needs to be clarified that they’re different - a simple sentence referring to the combat chapter is sufficient to remove any ambiguity.
I think you understand what I meant with that.
Repeated from my edited post above as you replied before I posted the edit :)

For me the issue is that Chapter 3 explains how skill rolls work and provides two ways (regular skill checks and opposed rolls). The Combat chapter then adds a variation to those rules (reaction skill rolls) but doesn’t refer to whether it is a variation to the standard skill roll or the opposed rolls rules. That’s why I suggest that it needs to be clarified - a simple sentence would remove any ambiguity.
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Tue 03 Jan 2023, 21:11



Except you just said they’re a variant of the opposing roll rule - which they’re not. They don’t resemble the Opposing Roll rules at all. They’re a standard skill check made in reaction to a successful attack. They are their own thing which is why I suggest that it needs to be clarified that they’re different - a simple sentence referring to the combat chapter is sufficient to remove any ambiguity.
I think you understand what I meant with that.
Repeated from my edited post above as you replied before I posted the edit :)

For me the issue is that Chapter 3 explains how skill rolls work and provides two ways (regular skill checks and opposed rolls). The Combat chapter then adds a variation to those rules (reaction skill rolls) but doesn’t refer to whether it is a variation to the standard skill roll or the opposed rolls rules. That’s why I suggest that it needs to be clarified - a simple sentence would remove any ambiguity.
I called it it a variant of an opposed roll because technically it is. You are trying to negate another persons skill roll. But clearly this went over the head.

So:

Parry and Dodge rolls are Reaction rolls and has nothing to do with the Opposed Roll rule whatsoever.
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
 
zcthu3
Posts: 121
Joined: Wed 29 May 2019, 10:34

Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Tue 03 Jan 2023, 21:29



I think you understand what I meant with that.
Repeated from my edited post above as you replied before I posted the edit :)

For me the issue is that Chapter 3 explains how skill rolls work and provides two ways (regular skill checks and opposed rolls). The Combat chapter then adds a variation to those rules (reaction skill rolls) but doesn’t refer to whether it is a variation to the standard skill roll or the opposed rolls rules. That’s why I suggest that it needs to be clarified - a simple sentence would remove any ambiguity.
I called it it a variant of an opposed roll because technically it is. You are trying to negate another persons skill roll. But clearly this went over the head.

So:

Parry and Dodge rolls are Reaction rolls and has nothing to do with the Opposed Roll rule whatsoever.
No, I got your point. My point is that it works nothing like an opposed roll, where you compare skill rolls. Rather it works like a standard skill roll. This is why it can be misconstrued because:

1. It technically meets the definition of an “opposed roll” as it is being used to oppose another skill roll (as you point out above); but
2. It is then resolved like a standard skill roll not as an opposed roll.

When I read the reaction rules, I initially read them as being resolved like an “opposed roll” precisely because they were being used in opposition and therefore met the definition of an opposed roll in Chapter 3. But that’s not the intent. I am suggesting the intent could be clarified by a sentence saying that reaction rolls are not opposed rolls as described on p.33.

Effectively, Chapter 3 outlines the basic mechanics of the system but Chapter 4 then introduces a variation to those rules without relating it back to the basic skill system which leads to ambiguity.
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Tue 03 Jan 2023, 21:39

I will back out of this nonsense discussion. Besides being just a forum member, I have another role on this forum that I will need to focus on.
edit: This is just me avoiding sitting on two chairs. Please don't quote or comment on this post.
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
 
Banquo
Posts: 33
Joined: Wed 31 Aug 2022, 10:35

Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Wed 04 Jan 2023, 18:57

Ranged Combat: currently the rules state “Parrying a ranged attack requires a shield. It works the same way as in melee combat
Does this mean that a character still gets a boon to parry missiles rolls (which was added in the latest version for melee parries IIRC)? I think parrying an arrow or similar with a shield shouldn’t get that advantage, but is a base skill test only.
 
Sharkman
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat 07 Jan 2023, 21:09

Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Sat 07 Jan 2023, 21:14

Hi there,

You guys have probably thought about it, but why not make Parry/Dodge a Willpower point cost of 3, rather than an action? This way players can still feel like they have a turn after a successful Parry/Dodge, but also keeps the tension as they have to balance between using WP's for their abilities or avoiding a potentially lethal hit.

Having said this, I really like how the game is shaping up.

Thanks!
 
Sharkman
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat 07 Jan 2023, 21:09

Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Sat 07 Jan 2023, 21:30

Hi there,

You guys have probably thought about it, but why not make Parry/Dodge a Willpower point cost of 3, rather than an action? This way players can still feel like they have a turn after a successful Parry/Dodge, but also keeps the tension as they have to balance between using WP's for their abilities or avoiding a potentially lethal hit.

Having said this, I really like how the game is shaping up.

Thanks!
I should probably add that Parry/Dodge should still be rolled for so there is still that possibility of failing and receiving damage.

Furthermore, perhaps once you don't have the adequate amount of WP's for a Parry/Dodge you can revert back to it costing a full action.

Just a thought :)
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Sat 07 Jan 2023, 21:33

There are Heroic Abilities that allows you to make a Parry/Dodge without spending an action.
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
 
Sharkman
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat 07 Jan 2023, 21:09

Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Sat 07 Jan 2023, 21:42

Hi there,

You guys have probably thought about it, but why not make Parry/Dodge a Willpower point cost of 3, rather than an action? This way players can still feel like they have a turn after a successful Parry/Dodge, but also keeps the tension as they have to balance between using WP's for their abilities or avoiding a potentially lethal hit.

Having said this, I really like how the game is shaping up.

Thanks!
I should probably add that Parry/Dodge should still be rolled for so there is still that possibility of failing and receiving damage.

Nevermind, I have been informed that these are already heroic abilities XD


Furthermore, perhaps once you don't have the adequate amount of WP's for a Parry/Dodge you can revert back to it costing a full action.

Just a thought :)
 
Sharkman
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat 07 Jan 2023, 21:09

Re: Dragonbane BETA v2 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 4 Combat & Damage

Sat 07 Jan 2023, 21:43

There are Heroic Abilities that allows you to make a Parry/Dodge without spending an action.
Yep, XD I clearly didn't read the rules properly
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