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Tomas
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Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Sun 05 Feb 2023, 12:18

Hi!

Please use this thread to post feedback and report any typos or errors in Chapter 8 of the version 3 Beta PDF of the Dragonbane Rulebook. Guidelines to remember:
  • Before reporting an error, please check and see if it already has been reported, and if so, don't report it again.
  • If you feedbacked on something in the the first version of the BETA but it's not changed in the version two of the BETA, it's not because we missed it - it's because we made a different assessment. (Typos are a different thing.)
Please report your feedback no later than February 28.
Thank you!
Fria Ligan
 
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Melvin
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Sun 05 Feb 2023, 12:56

I did report this already but because there is still no change, maybe with a picture it would be better?

Image
 
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Tomas
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Sun 05 Feb 2023, 16:57

I did report this already but because there is still no change, maybe with a picture it would be better?

Image
Thanks!
Fria Ligan
 
Von Ether
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Tue 07 Feb 2023, 05:30

If Common Animals were in the NPC section, it would avoid potential confusion since they are technically monsters and thus treat most spells as monsters would. I think many gamers will assume a wizard could make a dog fall asleep?

I assume orcs and goblins DO treat spells as the rest of the monsters do even though they perform combat as NPCs. If are susceptible to spells like Sleep, it might be better to just make them NPCs.

On that note with Sleep, Boss NPCs need something for a WILL attribute. Since NPCs have a default unskilled roll of 5, it might need clarification their default attribute is between 9 to 12?

Though reverse engineering the Boss NPCs put their WILL at 16 (Bandit chief), 14 (Knight), and 18 (Archmage.)
 
simontmn
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Sun 12 Feb 2023, 12:25

How should a campfire interact with the Making Camp rules? Say you have a fire & sleeping furs, but no tent? I'm thinking something like bushcraft roll to light a fire (with boon if you have a fire pot or similar), fire gives a boon on sleeping roll makes cooking possible?
 
simontmn
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Sun 12 Feb 2023, 12:27

If Common Animals were in the NPC section, it would avoid potential confusion since they are technically monsters and thus treat most spells as monsters would. I think many gamers will assume a wizard could make a dog fall asleep?

I assume orcs and goblins DO treat spells as the rest of the monsters do even though they perform combat as NPCs. If are susceptible to spells like Sleep, it might be better to just make them NPCs.

On that note with Sleep, Boss NPCs need something for a WILL attribute. Since NPCs have a default unskilled roll of 5, it might need clarification their default attribute is between 9 to 12?

Though reverse engineering the Boss NPCs put their WILL at 16 (Bandit chief), 14 (Knight), and 18 (Archmage.)
I'm pretty sure the intent is that only capital-M Monsters with a Monster Attack table be treated as 'monsters', not animals, orcs, goblins etc. So Orcs Goblins etc are NPCs for all purposes. Being in the Bestiary doesn't make you a Monster.
 
Banquo
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Sun 12 Feb 2023, 17:26

Typo, p103 under cooking - “A field kitchen gives a boon to the rool” Should be roll not rool.
 
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Short Fey
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Thu 16 Feb 2023, 20:12

If npcs are in general not to make rolls regarding attributes (and skills), then perhaps you could clearify that in the npc section? So far it mainly coveres skills, but having something regarding attributes just to cover that base would be useful. (I know i been at this a lot, but i think this should be cleared up).

So for example:

MANAGING NPCS
Mechanically, NPCs function like player characters. They move, perform actions, sustain damage, and use WP in the same way. But in practice, you should disregard all rules mechanics for NPCs if they do not directly affect a player character. Don’t roll dice for actions performed by NPCs unless they are attacking or healing a player character. You can roll for NPCs in other situations if it enhances the drama, but usually there is no need for it. Remember, an NPC rolls against the default skill level of 5 if no other level is listed (page 33).

If an npc ends up in a situation where the game requires them to make a Attribute roll, such as being the target of a spell or poison, as a GM you should let the NPC automatically fail without making a roll. If you wish to make the stakes higher, or if the situation is dire, you can use the following rules to determine what values to use when making an attribute roll for an npc.

STR/AGL: An npcs STR/AGL attribute is based on their damage bonus die. 9 if they have none, 13 if they have a d4, and 17 if they have a d6
CON: An npcs CON is equal to their maximum HP value, EXCLUDING any points gained from the ROBUST Heroic ability.
WILL: An npcs WILL is equal to their maximum WP value, EXCLUDING any points gained from the FOCUSED heroic ability. If they have no WP listed, default to a value of 9.


Edit: added a point regarding WILL
Last edited by Short Fey on Fri 17 Feb 2023, 07:28, edited 1 time in total.
Beware the fey!
 
Raven
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Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Fri 17 Feb 2023, 05:11

If npcs are in general not to make rolls regarding attributes (and skills), then perhaps you could clearify that in the npc section? So far it mainly coveres skills, but having something regarding attributes just to cover that base would be useful. (I know i been at this a lot, but i think this should be cleared up).

So for example:

MANAGING NPCS
Mechanically, NPCs function like player characters. They move, perform actions, sustain damage, and use WP in the same way. But in practice, you should disregard all rules mechanics for NPCs if they do not directly affect a player character. Don’t roll dice for actions performed by NPCs unless they are attacking or healing a player character. You can roll for NPCs in other situations if it enhances the drama, but usually there is no need for it. Remember, an NPC rolls against the default skill level of 5 if no other level is listed (page 33).

If an npc ends up in a situation where the game requires them to make a Attribute roll, such as being the target of a spell or poison, as a GM you should let the NPC automatically fail without making a roll. If you wish to make the stakes higher, or if the situation is dire, you can use the following rules to determine what values to use when making an attribute roll for an npc.

STR/AGL: An npcs STR/AGL attribute is based on their damage bonus die. 9 if they have none, 13 if they have a d4, and 17 if they have a d6
CON: An npcs CON is equal to their maximum HP value, EXCLUDING any points gained from the ROBUST Heroic ability.
WILL: An npcs WILL is equal to their maximum WP value, EXCLUDING any points gained from the FOCUSED heroic ability.
In my opinion, that would work, but it's not really a relief for the game master. I guess this rule would have to be looked up 2-3 times in the game and recalculating HP and WP is another thing the gm has to concentrate on. Moreover, not all NPCs have their WP listed. It would be much easier, especialy for new gms, to put the attributes in the statblocks.
 
zcthu3
Posts: 121
Joined: Wed 29 May 2019, 10:34

Re: Dragonbane Beta v3 Rulebook Feedback - Chapter 8 Adventures

Fri 17 Feb 2023, 06:02

If npcs are in general not to make rolls regarding attributes (and skills), then perhaps you could clearify that in the npc section? So far it mainly coveres skills, but having something regarding attributes just to cover that base would be useful. (I know i been at this a lot, but i think this should be cleared up).

So for example:

MANAGING NPCS
Mechanically, NPCs function like player characters. They move, perform actions, sustain damage, and use WP in the same way. But in practice, you should disregard all rules mechanics for NPCs if they do not directly affect a player character. Don’t roll dice for actions performed by NPCs unless they are attacking or healing a player character. You can roll for NPCs in other situations if it enhances the drama, but usually there is no need for it. Remember, an NPC rolls against the default skill level of 5 if no other level is listed (page 33).

If an npc ends up in a situation where the game requires them to make a Attribute roll, such as being the target of a spell or poison, as a GM you should let the NPC automatically fail without making a roll. If you wish to make the stakes higher, or if the situation is dire, you can use the following rules to determine what values to use when making an attribute roll for an npc.

STR/AGL: An npcs STR/AGL attribute is based on their damage bonus die. 9 if they have none, 13 if they have a d4, and 17 if they have a d6
CON: An npcs CON is equal to their maximum HP value, EXCLUDING any points gained from the ROBUST Heroic ability.
WILL: An npcs WILL is equal to their maximum WP value, EXCLUDING any points gained from the FOCUSED heroic ability.
In my opinion, that would work, but it's not really a relief for the game master. I guess this rule would have to be looked up 2-3 times in the game and recalculating HP and WP is another thing the gm has to concentrate on. Moreover, not all NPCs have their WP listed. It would be much easier, especialy for new gms, to put the attributes in the statblocks.
TBH I don’t like a rule which says NPCs auto-fail. While it says the only time you have to roll for NPCs is when they are “attacking or healing” it also says you can roll when “it enhances the drama”. That doesn’t mean they automatically fail the rest of the time - whether they succeed or fail in the absence of the PCs should always be situation specific. If the King is targeted by an NPC poisoner, they shouldn’t automatically fail and die (which is what Short Fey’s rule would suggest), rather the GM should choose whether they want them to succeed or fail. Maybe they succeed but fall ill. If it was the PCs poisoning the king on the other hand, then it is likely that success or failure matters, and in that case (IMO) you need to roll.

EDIT:
Basically, the rule as written is fine - in the absence of PC intervention NPCs don’t roll, you just go with what makes sense. If the PCs are interacting with an NPC and success or failure matters (ie increases the drama) the NPCs should roll. And while I largely agree with Short Fey’s way of calculating attributes in the absence of attributes, it’s much better to just include an attribute line for NPCs.

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