Help me out here, please. What do the rules say about this?
1. Can a combatant assume an overwatch position with his last action and wait until the next round before firing ?
E.g. if a combatant first shoots on his turn, can he then assume an overwatch position with his remaining fast action?
I presume it’s possible since a combatant with a scope can assume the position even though he cannot shoot until the next round.
2. Can a combatant assume an overwatch position with a bow? (And remain in that position until attacked/suppressed/wounded?)
3. Are there any rules concerning indirect fire from bows?
4. Has anyone compiled a flowchart or a summary of combat? (I have, in Swedish, and I would like to compare).
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- baldrick0712
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Re: Overwatch fire prerequisite and misc.
No. "Firing when in overwatch position counts as a normal, aimed, ranged attack (a slow action). Therefore, you must save your slow action in the round to be able to make an overwatch attack" (Players Manual p66)Help me out here, please. What do the rules say about this?
1. Can a combatant assume an overwatch position with his last action and wait until the next round before firing ?
E.g. if a combatant first shoots on his turn, can he then assume an overwatch position with his remaining fast action?
I presume it’s possible since a combatant with a scope can assume the position even though he cannot shoot until the next round.
[EDIT]
Sorry, Yes. You could for instance Reload, enter Overwatch, then Shoot on the following round. Or you could shoot with a penalty for not aiming, enter Overwatch (but not using telescopic sights), then Shoot again the following round.
Last edited by baldrick0712 on Fri 05 Nov 2021, 19:30, edited 3 times in total.
Re: Overwatch fire prerequisite and misc.
Yes, as you said, you even have to wait until your next turn if you assume overwatch position and wants to use your scope aiming bonus. You just can't use any action before you execute the overwatch fire.1. Can a combatant assume an overwatch position with his last action and wait until the next round before firing ?
E.g. if a combatant first shoots on his turn, can he then assume an overwatch position with his remaining fast action?
I presume it’s possible since a combatant with a scope can assume the position even though he cannot shoot until the next round.
(edit: just to be clear. This is my interpretation of how it works based on that if you want to use your telescopic sight aiming bonus in overwatch fire, it is a slow action to go into overwatch, not a fast action. This means that in such a case, you have to wait until you get two fresh actions in order to execute you can execute your overwatch fire. So, why shouldn't you be allowed to use a fast action to go into overwatch, but then wait to your next turn to execute the fire, even though you don't gain anything by doing so).
Technically, no, when it comes to bows, because after have prepared the bow, you can't do any other action but to aim or shoot, although I will probably allow that though.2. Can a combatant assume an overwatch position with a bow? (And remain in that position until attacked/suppressed/wounded?)
No, but sure, technically with explosive arrows, it could perhaps be used that way, I guess. But in RAW, no.3. Are there any rules concerning indirect fire from bows?
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
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- baldrick0712
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Re: Overwatch fire prerequisite and misc.
I guess the intent of the rule is that once in Overwatch you have to use a Slow action to fire, either in the same round or a later round. Therefore, if you're a sniper, you would not be able to go into Overwatch and fire in the same round as it would cost two Slow actions. However, I think the following examples would be OK...
N.B. - Edited as you CAN use telescopic sights but you don't HAVE TO use them (scopes are often mounted above iron sights that can still be used to aim).
No telescopic sights or not using them...
Round 1: Fast Action: Enter Overwatch
Round 1: Slow Action: Shoot
or...
Round 1: Fast or Slow Action: Reload
Round 1: Fast Action: Enter Overwatch
Round 2: Slow Action: Shoot
Using telescopic sights...
Round 1: Fast Action: Reload (you'd have to succeed at your Ranged Combat roll)
Round 1: Slow Action: Enter Overwatch
Round 2: Slow Action: Shoot with +1 modifier for telescopic sights (+2 if prone with bipod)
N.B. - Edited as you CAN use telescopic sights but you don't HAVE TO use them (scopes are often mounted above iron sights that can still be used to aim).
No telescopic sights or not using them...
Round 1: Fast Action: Enter Overwatch
Round 1: Slow Action: Shoot
or...
Round 1: Fast or Slow Action: Reload
Round 1: Fast Action: Enter Overwatch
Round 2: Slow Action: Shoot
Using telescopic sights...
Round 1: Fast Action: Reload (you'd have to succeed at your Ranged Combat roll)
Round 1: Slow Action: Enter Overwatch
Round 2: Slow Action: Shoot with +1 modifier for telescopic sights (+2 if prone with bipod)
Last edited by baldrick0712 on Fri 05 Nov 2021, 18:32, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Overwatch fire prerequisite and misc.
I'm a bit slow, I know and could you please elaborate a little?
"Therefore, you must save your slow action in the round to be able to make an overwatch attack" refers to the attack, not to assume the position, does it not?
I was wondering whether a combatant can assume the overwatch position, not to make an overwatch attack.
Although, if a combatant isn't eligible to make an attack, then he might not be able to assume the position? (However, a combatant with a scope can assume the position without being able to make the attack, right?).
"Therefore, you must save your slow action in the round to be able to make an overwatch attack" refers to the attack, not to assume the position, does it not?
I was wondering whether a combatant can assume the overwatch position, not to make an overwatch attack.
Although, if a combatant isn't eligible to make an attack, then he might not be able to assume the position? (However, a combatant with a scope can assume the position without being able to make the attack, right?).
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- baldrick0712
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Re: Overwatch fire prerequisite and misc.
In effect I think going on Overwatch is effectively an "Aim" action that gives you a deferred "Shoot" action (such as when target pops up over hard cover). If you think of it in those terms I think it's pretty clear.
Re: Overwatch fire prerequisite and misc.
You first have to assume overwatch position. This is normally a fast action, but is a slow action if you have a telescopic sight. This allows you to aim at a selected hex and at anytime after that, you can fire your weapon at any one target in that hex. This count as an aimed ranged combat attack and is a slow action. In order for you to do this you need to have a slow action available.I'm a bit slow, I know and could you please elaborate a little?
"Therefore, you must save your slow action in the round to be able to make an overwatch attack" refers to the attack, not to assume the position, does it not?
I was wondering whether a combatant can assume the overwatch position, not to make an overwatch attack.
Although, if a combatant isn't eligible to make an attack, then he might not be able to assume the position? (However, a combatant with a scope can assume the position without being able to make the attack, right?).
As already been mention above here is how it goes.
Round 1
You spend your fast action to assume overwatch position. You select a hex and that's it. You save your slow action so you can use that for the overwatch fire action. At any time after this until the start of your next turn, you can execute this overwatch fire (and thus spend your saved slow action).
Round 2
You don't need to assume overwatch position again (unless you want to switch hex or something), but you can just keep being in overwatch at the same hex. Again you save your slow action so you can use it to shoot something in the hex.
Overwatch is broken if you do anything other than overwatch fire or if you are attacked in melee or if you suffer damage or if you become suppressed.
If you have a telescopic sight, then it is a slow action to assume overwatch position, which means that you don't have any slow action left for the overwatch fire, in this case you have to wait until your next round, like this.
Round 1
You spend your slow action to assume overwatch position and you select a hex. You can't use it for now since you don't have any slow action left.
Round 2
Since you don't loose your overwatch position, by doing nothing, you are still in overwatch position, but now you have have a slow action to save and this means that you can use that slow action for an overwatch fire with your telescopic sight.
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
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- baldrick0712
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Re: Overwatch fire prerequisite and misc.
I agree with Fenhorn but see my edited response above about choosing to use iron sights even though you have a scoped rifle. Not sure how common this would be but certainly in WWII sniper rifles had both iron and telescopic sights available (first if you need to quickly shoot at a close target or just don't have time to aim using the scope).
Re: Overwatch fire prerequisite and misc.
I agree. Just because you have a telescopic sight, you have to use it. There might be situations when you want to skip it, because it is faster to use the iron sight, in normal ranged combat or in overwatch fire.I agree with Fenhorn but see my edited response above about choosing to use iron sights even though you have a scoped rifle. Not sure how common this would be but certainly in WWII sniper rifles had both iron and telescopic sights available (first if you need to quickly shoot at a close target or just don't have time to aim using the scope).
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
Re: Overwatch fire prerequisite and misc.
Good. Thank you for your response.You first have to assume overwatch position. This is normally a fast action, but is a slow action if you have a telescopic sight. This allows you to aim at a selected hex and at anytime after that, you can fire your weapon at any one target in that hex. This count as an aimed ranged combat attack and is a slow action. In order for you to do this you need to have a slow action available.I'm a bit slow, I know and could you please elaborate a little?
"Therefore, you must save your slow action in the round to be able to make an overwatch attack" refers to the attack, not to assume the position, does it not?
I was wondering whether a combatant can assume the overwatch position, not to make an overwatch attack.
Although, if a combatant isn't eligible to make an attack, then he might not be able to assume the position? (However, a combatant with a scope can assume the position without being able to make the attack, right?).
As already been mention above here is how it goes.
Round 1
You spend your fast action to assume overwatch position. You select a hex and that's it. You save your slow action so you can use that for the overwatch fire action. At any time after this until the start of your next turn, you can execute this overwatch fire (and thus spend your saved slow action).
Round 2
You don't need to assume overwatch position again (unless you want to switch hex or something), but you can just keep being in overwatch at the same hex. Again you save your slow action so you can use it to shoot something in the hex.
Overwatch is broken if you do anything other than overwatch fire or if you are attacked in melee or if you suffer damage or if you become suppressed.
If you have a telescopic sight, then it is a slow action to assume overwatch position, which means that you don't have any slow action left for the overwatch fire, in this case you have to wait until your next round, like this.
Round 1
You spend your slow action to assume overwatch position and you select a hex. You can't use it for now since you don't have any slow action left.
Round 2
Since you don't loose your overwatch position, by doing nothing, you are still in overwatch position, but now you have have a slow action to save and this means that you can use that slow action for an overwatch fire with your telescopic sight.
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