gru
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Pushing journey rolls?

Wed 08 Jul 2020, 22:11

Are there some rules or suggestions about journey rolls? My party has pretty good Survival folks, so I can't really recall the last time a mishap happened. How often are mishaps expected to happen during journeys? I feel like at the moment the journey is just a lot of rolls to move through the hexes, but not as much adventure (i.e. actually creative work to make journey happen). Is that intended b y the game or are there ways to spice things up?

We roll for encounters on entering a new hex and also during night.
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Pushing journey rolls?

Wed 08 Jul 2020, 22:22

Some GMs (me included) have started to not allowing for pushing when you make a Lead the Way roll or Make Camp (some even the other Journey rolls). The reason for this is just like you say, these rolls are very easy to begin with and with a push, even easier and usually you can rest to regain any lost attributes so the characters actually don't risk anything.

You can also add another reason for not pushing Lead the Way and Make Camp rolls. Those two rolls are just rolls to avoid mishaps, mishaps that you don't know exist. With Lead the Way, you most of the time will get into the next hex regardless of the outcome of the skill roll (there is one lost result i think). With the Make Camp roll you will get a camp, to roll is to avoid an unknown mishap. It feel strange to be able to push in a quarter day skill roll for something that you don't even know about. For me, this last reason is actually stronger than the first reason. The first reason (that nothing usually happens) will be solved as a bonus by not allowing the pushing those two rolls.
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
 
Konungr
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Re: Pushing journey rolls?

Wed 08 Jul 2020, 23:08

The only times i allow for a push is if they are at deaths door and looking for food or water or shelter to survive. In those instances it makes sense that a character might push and suffer damage where it matters. Otherwise these activities take 1/4 day and can be done at leisure. There is no pushing for 6 hours of hunting on a full stomache.
 
gru
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Re: Pushing journey rolls?

Thu 09 Jul 2020, 17:29

Thanks a lot for the advice! Are there some raw rules that supports this? I wouldn't like to change the rules against the design. I assume the designers of the game tested this and it's expected the journey to be very easy if the party is prepared. However, if there are supporting rules, I would take advantage of them. I saw that GM has the final say on pushing successful rolls, but I don't see the same thing on failed ones.
 
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lupex
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Re: Pushing journey rolls?

Thu 09 Jul 2020, 18:31

Well the rules now state that you can only push a successful roll if it would give you additional benefits, so most journey rolls won’t need to be pushed.
 
gru
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Re: Pushing journey rolls?

Thu 09 Jul 2020, 19:41

@lupex Yep, I am aware. I am specifically asking about any rules associated when failed rolls can be pushed. This is what this thread is about..
 
Konungr
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Re: Pushing journey rolls?

Thu 09 Jul 2020, 20:07

It's just the general rule that any skill roll can be pushed with the adendum that the GM has final say.

My question is what makes the time spent interesting? Players natually want to avoid negatives but negatives are what start and build interesting situations and make great stories. If for no other reason thats why you should not allow those rolls to be pushed. It gives the game fertile ground for interesting things to happen that the players will otherwise avoid.
 
gru
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Re: Pushing journey rolls?

Thu 09 Jul 2020, 22:37

Agreed! Without mishaps/encounters, it's just rolling 10 times to get from one place to another, which is hardly exciting.

> It's just the general rule that any skill roll can be pushed with the adendum that the GM has final say.

Is this spelled out anywhere? I tried to find this in the player's handbook, but couldn't find it. For me, personally, the handbook rules are sort of an interface for the party how the game is played and how they can strategize and plan their characters.
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Pushing journey rolls?

Thu 09 Jul 2020, 23:16

In Year Zero games you are not suppose to roll to often.

Extract from textbox p.44
<> you should only roll when absolutely necessary, in dramatic situations or tough challenges. In any other situation, the GM should simply state that your action succeeds.

When it comes to pushing, you are only allowed to push if additional successes will increase the effect of the roll in some way. The GM has final say in this.

When it comes to Lead the Way and Make Camp, both of those will happen regardless of how many successes you get, and as mentioned above, the only thing that successes does is to avoid (unknown) mishaps. According to RAW, you are probably allowed to push these skill rolls, but you can also interpret that it is not possible to push a skill roll that takes a quarter day to perform against something that is unknown. It isn't RAW exactly but it isn't that far off either.

Also the player is suppose to describe, not only the normal skill roll, but also if he pushes the roll, what the character is actually doing. This is something that may be forgotten sometimes that the character is making the action and the push, it isn't just something that the player is doing and if the player can't describe what the character actually is doing when wants to do an action or when he wants to push, then that is a reason for not allowing the skill use or push in the first place.
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
 
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hperantunes
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Re: Pushing journey rolls?

Sun 12 Jul 2020, 06:45

I've always let the players roll and push (when pushable) their Journey activities, but as the group got more experienced and skilled these rolls have become almost a waste of session time. Also, since Journey rolls are a major source of WP farming in my game, I've decided to stop rolling these activities when the stakes aren't hign enough and simply let the characters succeed.

For activities like Foraging, Hunting and Fishing, here's how I plan to compensate for the missing extra successes a player could potentially have:

  • Ability is at 3 or more: +1 success.
  • Skill is 3 or more: +1 success.
  • Bonus from Talent: +1 success.
  • Artifact Die is applicable: +1 success.

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