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Re: Orcs as Kin, not fodder

Posted: Mon 01 Oct 2018, 14:15
by Rymdhamster
I have to say, that when I GM I kind of like it when players try to negotiate and make deals rather than fighting, and if anything I always tend to make orcs in other games more nuanced in order to facilitate this.
But when I want to have orcs that are pure enemies that you need to fight, I like to add some sort of marker for this, like Sauromans white hand. Or from another game that the "pure evil" orc wore sacks over their heads as masks. The sacks was a sign that no quarter would be given, nor asked.
In Ravland, witht he abscence of a proper central power as far as I know, I would probably attribute this to some for of drug. Kind of like the legends of vikings eating toxic shrooms to psych up before a battle. But with some noticable physical effect such as the eyes glowing in a specific color (depending on weather or not you consider orcs to have glowing red eyes as default or not). The effect of the drug itself would make them these crazy, bloodthirsty beasts that can't be reasoned with.
You could use the orch Isir clan with green venomous saliva as a marker. They're often just out to kill everybody else.
Sounds perfect! And scary! I'm glad to say we haven't run in to those yet, as far as I know =D

Re: Orcs as Kin, not fodder

Posted: Mon 01 Oct 2018, 20:07
by Eldhierta
I use the orcs as small bands or minor clans. Like the movie "The Warriors" were most characters are street thugs, but still have personalities once you get to know them. If you step into another orcs turf, you better deal, beg or fight your way through.
The reason that Ravenland is not a new Mordor, is just because they lack a true leader. If someone could unite all the clans, the other races would probably be wiped out. 

The computergame Shadow of Mordor is also a great inspiration of orc politics. 
But the goal of the orcs is not world domination. They want revenge and the right to their own lands, their own lives. It is almost a matter of proving themselves to their former masters, a "we are your equals, not your slaves" type of thing.

I liked Shadow of Mordor, but I don't think it's a suitable likeness for the orcs in the Forbidden Lands. The orcs in Tolkien's world are tortured elves, corrupted by rage, pain and darkness while the orcs in FbL are a former slave race, presumably cast in that role by the Raven god, who were then abandoned by their masters and chose to make their own path in Ravenland. Two very different backstories.

Re: Orcs as Kin, not fodder

Posted: Mon 01 Oct 2018, 21:06
by Röteborgaren
But the goal of the orcs is not world domination. They want revenge and the right to their own lands, their own lives. It is almost a matter of proving themselves to their former masters, a "we are your equals, not your slaves" type of thing.
Which is why I'm writing an adventure site about the time the orcs of the Eye of the Rose decided to arrange their own knightly tournament to prove they can be just as civilized as everyone else.

Re: Orcs as Kin, not fodder

Posted: Mon 01 Oct 2018, 21:17
by Eldhierta
But the goal of the orcs is not world domination. They want revenge and the right to their own lands, their own lives. It is almost a matter of proving themselves to their former masters, a "we are your equals, not your slaves" type of thing.
Which is why I'm writing an adventure site about the time the orcs of the Eye of the Rose decided to arrange their own knightly tournament to prove they can be just as civilized as everyone else.
Sounds epic :D

Re: Orcs as Kin, not fodder

Posted: Mon 01 Oct 2018, 22:37
by Röteborgaren
Sounds epic :D
It certainly is epic in my head! Just need to get it in writing...

Re: Orcs as Kin, not fodder

Posted: Tue 02 Oct 2018, 10:27
by Daarkh
But the goal of the orcs is not world domination. They want revenge and the right to their own lands, their own lives. It is almost a matter of proving themselves to their former masters, a "we are your equals, not your slaves" type of thing.

I liked Shadow of Mordor, but I don't think it's a suitable likeness for the orcs in the Forbidden Lands. The orcs in Tolkien's world are tortured elves, corrupted by rage, pain and darkness while the orcs in FbL are a former slave race, presumably cast in that role by the Raven god, who were then abandoned by their masters and chose to make their own path in Ravenland. Two very different backstories.
I would say that it depends on who you ask. There are three clans of orcs already described in the official books, and we houseruled a couple of more as orcs creates new clans as the old ones breaks. Your description of the Mordor orcs, could easily fit in with the Isir clan. So sure, some orcs would love to get a nice little hut in the middle of nowhere to live in peace, but others surely would like to take over Ravland and force all other races into slavery. I guess there is no "Orcs doesn't.." really. They are all individuals as well, each one with a personal goal in life.  ;) 

Re: Orcs as Kin, not fodder

Posted: Tue 02 Oct 2018, 16:17
by Eldhierta
But the goal of the orcs is not world domination. They want revenge and the right to their own lands, their own lives. It is almost a matter of proving themselves to their former masters, a "we are your equals, not your slaves" type of thing.

I liked Shadow of Mordor, but I don't think it's a suitable likeness for the orcs in the Forbidden Lands. The orcs in Tolkien's world are tortured elves, corrupted by rage, pain and darkness while the orcs in FbL are a former slave race, presumably cast in that role by the Raven god, who were then abandoned by their masters and chose to make their own path in Ravenland. Two very different backstories.
I would say that it depends on who you ask. There are three clans of orcs already described in the official books, and we houseruled a couple of more as orcs creates new clans as the old ones breaks. Your description of the Mordor orcs, could easily fit in with the Isir clan. So sure, some orcs would love to get a nice little hut in the middle of nowhere to live in peace, but others surely would like to take over Ravland and force all other races into slavery. I guess there is no "Orcs doesn't.." really. They are all individuals as well, each one with a personal goal in life.  ;) 
Of course. I was mainly protesting the part about the only thing standing in the way of orc world domination was the lack of a strong leader. That could be true for any race, if you wanted to push that argument. So I guess we agree that there are no "Orcs don't"''s, but maybe also no "Orcs dos"'s. They are all individuals, albeit of the same Kin.

Re: Orcs as Kin, not fodder

Posted: Tue 02 Oct 2018, 16:25
by Brior
Of course. I was mainly protesting the part about the only thing standing in the way of orc world domination was the lack of a strong leader. That could be true for any race, if you wanted to push that argument. So I guess we agree that there are no "Orcs don't"''s, but maybe also no "Orcs dos"'s. They are all individuals, albeit of the same Kin.
As you have noted, I tried to insert different agendas, tempers and beliefs internally in all Ravenland kins. To me this makes the world more interesting and ”realistic” and also gives the players more choices when deciding how they prefer to play.

Humans have grave problems when it comes to religion and use of magic, dwarves have political and prestige issues between clans while elves range from pacifistic to racist and fascist. Orchs vary in brutality and attempts to build societies