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History

Posted: Sun 01 Oct 2017, 11:26
by Brior
Another thread for the backstory of Ravenland.

Re: History

Posted: Wed 04 Oct 2017, 08:44
by Birkebeineren
How far back will the history go? Just a few hundred years to when the Forbidden Lands became forbidden or all the way back to the beginning of time? And will the history be written as pure facts or from an in-game perspective with misunderstandings, interpretations and knowledge missing?

It could be interesting to read the same history from the perspective from both lets say orcs and dwarves, and then try to figure out what really happened.

Re: History

Posted: Wed 04 Oct 2017, 10:01
by Brior
How far back will the history go? Just a few hundred years to when the Forbidden Lands became forbidden or all the way back to the beginning of time? And will the history be written as pure facts or from an in-game perspective with misunderstandings, interpretations and knowledge missing?

It could be interesting to read the same history from the perspective from both lets say orcs and dwarves, and then try to figure out what really happened.
Humans arrived in Ravenland-to-be about 1200 years ago, and the backstory starts then and is written from the perspective of Alderland humans. Note that this is how history is percieved and some of it might not be true. I have some ideas that adds aspects if we do expansions.
The stories of other peoples mostly is presented in relation to the human one, but it is fairly clear what they think, I hope, while this might be something to expand upon. The dwarves probably keep track of events but more for administrative purposes. Orc lack a written language of their own and probably keep track of their history by storytelling prone to change (some literate orcs use human or elven writing on a phonetic base). Elves have a tendency not to think that much about time passing, being essentially immortal. Also they only have rudimentary hierarchy and lineage to keep track of. I picture them to live in an ongoing NOW – kairos more than chronos if that makes sense to you (if not, see link*). Elves interested in nature often have a cyclic perception of time.
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kairos

Re: History

Posted: Wed 04 Oct 2017, 14:48
by Harper
How far back will the history go? Just a few hundred years to when the Forbidden Lands became forbidden or all the way back to the beginning of time? And will the history be written as pure facts or from an in-game perspective with misunderstandings, interpretations and knowledge missing?

It could be interesting to read the same history from the perspective from both lets say orcs and dwarves, and then try to figure out what really happened.
Humans arrived in Ravenland-to-be about 1200 years ago, and the backstory starts then and is written from the perspective of Alderland humans. Note that this is how history is percieved and some of it might not be true. I have some ideas that adds aspects if we do expansions.
The stories of other peoples mostly is presented in relation to the human one, but it is fairly clear what they think, I hope, while this might be something to expand upon. The dwarves probably keep track of events but more for administrative purposes. Orc lack a written language of their own and probably keep track of their history by storytelling prone to change (some literate orcs use human or elven writing on a phonetic base). Elves have a tendency not to think that much about time passing, being essentially immortal. Also they only have rudimentary hierarchy and lineage to keep track of. I picture them to live in an ongoing NOW – kairos more than chronos if that makes sense to you (if not, see link*). Elves interested in nature often have a cyclic perception of time.
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kairos
Wouldn't that put them in the living memory of elves?
If they live so long, maybe they remember before the men came?

Re: History

Posted: Wed 04 Oct 2017, 15:52
by Brior
Wouldn't that put them in the living memory of elves?
If they live so long, maybe they remember before the men came?
Harper, I'm not totally sure who you refer to by ”them”.
In any case, elves don't necessarily remember everything just beacuse they live long, even less so if they don't rally care and don't keep records. This to me is a possibility rather than something bad, since it let's us decide what they chose to remember depending on what context we need. All of them may not be indifferent, but may have very specific interests rather than caring about the totality – perhaps they vividly remember smells or old songs, but not who made them or what the text was about. I'm a fan of Iain M Banks Culture novels and would like to see these very long lived elves as highly excentric, much like Banks' ship minds. Some impatient elves (probably those you choose to play will be among them), dislike this attitude and think elves should act and perhaps restore what they lost.
Also I describe a group called ”Hembärarna” ≈ ”The Gatherers” who curiously walk around the land, returning to inform their less mobile kin about what's going on. This information might be recieved as something important or just as entertainment.
Altogether I think this view on elves opens up for possibilities.

Re: History

Posted: Wed 04 Oct 2017, 15:54
by 9littlebees
Wouldn't that put them in the living memory of elves?
If they live so long, maybe they remember before the men came?
Harper, I'm not totally sure who you refer to by ”them”.
In any case, elves don't necessarily remember everything just beacuse they live long, even less so if they don't rally care and don't keep records. This to me is a possibility rather than something bad, since it let's us decide what they chose to remember depending on what context we need. All of them may not be indifferent, but may have very specific interests rather than caring about the totality – perhaps they vividly remember smells or old songs, but not who made them or what the text was about. I'm a fan of Iain M Banks Culture novels and would like to see these very long lived elves as highly excentric, much like Banks' ship minds. Some impatient elves (probably those you choose to play will be among them), dislike this attitude and think elves should act and perhaps restore what they lost.
Also I describe a group called ”Hembärarna” ≈ ”The Gatherers” who curiously walk around the land, returning to inform their less mobile kin about what's going on. This information might be recieved as something important or just as entertainment.
Altogether I think this view on elves opens up for possibilities.
As a big fan of the Culture novels, this sounds awesome to me. :)

Re: History

Posted: Wed 04 Oct 2017, 16:46
by King_Kull
Wouldn't that put them in the living memory of elves?
If they live so long, maybe they remember before the men came?
Harper, I'm not totally sure who you refer to by ”them”.
In any case, elves don't necessarily remember everything just beacuse they live long, even less so if they don't rally care and don't keep records. This to me is a possibility rather than something bad, since it let's us decide what they chose to remember depending on what context we need. All of them may not be indifferent, but may have very specific interests rather than caring about the totality – perhaps they vividly remember smells or old songs, but not who made them or what the text was about. I'm a fan of Iain M Banks Culture novels and would like to see these very long lived elves as highly excentric, much like Banks' ship minds. Some impatient elves (probably those you choose to play will be among them), dislike this attitude and think elves should act and perhaps restore what they lost.
Also I describe a group called ”Hembärarna” ≈ ”The Gatherers” who curiously walk around the land, returning to inform their less mobile kin about what's going on. This information might be recieved as something important or just as entertainment.
Altogether I think this view on elves opens up for possibilities.
As a big fan of the Culture novels, this sounds awesome to me. :)
Don’t know the books but the approach sounds very interesting!

Re: History

Posted: Wed 04 Oct 2017, 21:39
by Birkebeineren
How far back will the history go? Just a few hundred years to when the Forbidden Lands became forbidden or all the way back to the beginning of time? And will the history be written as pure facts or from an in-game perspective with misunderstandings, interpretations and knowledge missing?

It could be interesting to read the same history from the perspective from both lets say orcs and dwarves, and then try to figure out what really happened.
Humans arrived in Ravenland-to-be about 1200 years ago, and the backstory starts then and is written from the perspective of Alderland humans. Note that this is how history is percieved and some of it might not be true. I have some ideas that adds aspects if we do expansions.
The stories of other peoples mostly is presented in relation to the human one, but it is fairly clear what they think, I hope, while this might be something to expand upon. The dwarves probably keep track of events but more for administrative purposes. Orc lack a written language of their own and probably keep track of their history by storytelling prone to change (some literate orcs use human or elven writing on a phonetic base). Elves have a tendency not to think that much about time passing, being essentially immortal. Also they only have rudimentary hierarchy and lineage to keep track of. I picture them to live in an ongoing NOW – kairos more than chronos if that makes sense to you (if not, see link*). Elves interested in nature often have a cyclic perception of time.
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kairos
1200 years sounds as a good choice, that give the setting time to have its own unique history but no more than it’s possible to fit in with a different world. For example both Svavelvinter and Ereb Altor have adaptable events placed 1200 years back in their world history.

I know of the koncept of kairos and chronos so i think i understand what you mean. A bit different with elves not only looking back in history like Tolkien described. Looking forward to learn more about them.

Dwarves maybe have a different way of recording history going back to a time when they hadn’t seen the world above their underground dwellings? Down in the dark they never saw the sun or the moon and couldn’t measure time in the same way people above ground does?

Re: History

Posted: Wed 04 Oct 2017, 22:00
by Harper
Wouldn't that put them in the living memory of elves?
If they live so long, maybe they remember before the men came?
Harper, I'm not totally sure who you refer to by ”them”.
In any case, elves don't necessarily remember everything just beacuse they live long, even less so if they don't rally care and don't keep records. This to me is a possibility rather than something bad, since it let's us decide what they chose to remember depending on what context we need. All of them may not be indifferent, but may have very specific interests rather than caring about the totality – perhaps they vividly remember smells or old songs, but not who made them or what the text was about. I'm a fan of Iain M Banks Culture novels and would like to see these very long lived elves as highly excentric, much like Banks' ship minds. Some impatient elves (probably those you choose to play will be among them), dislike this attitude and think elves should act and perhaps restore what they lost.
Also I describe a group called ”Hembärarna” ≈ ”The Gatherers” who curiously walk around the land, returning to inform their less mobile kin about what's going on. This information might be recieved as something important or just as entertainment.
Altogether I think this view on elves opens up for possibilities.
By "them" I mean "humans" due to you saying it was going to be from a human point of view,
If elves live so long, and be so literate it seems less likely their version of history would be so muddy, 
I'd make it the elves have the clearest historical facts, but it's not like humans would have easy access to it, 
I like the idea of playing a scout type elf, that makes a lot of sense,

Re: History

Posted: Wed 04 Oct 2017, 22:02
by Harper
Harper, I'm not totally sure who you refer to by ”them”.
In any case, elves don't necessarily remember everything just beacuse they live long, even less so if they don't rally care and don't keep records. This to me is a possibility rather than something bad, since it let's us decide what they chose to remember depending on what context we need. All of them may not be indifferent, but may have very specific interests rather than caring about the totality – perhaps they vividly remember smells or old songs, but not who made them or what the text was about. I'm a fan of Iain M Banks Culture novels and would like to see these very long lived elves as highly excentric, much like Banks' ship minds. Some impatient elves (probably those you choose to play will be among them), dislike this attitude and think elves should act and perhaps restore what they lost.
Also I describe a group called ”Hembärarna” ≈ ”The Gatherers” who curiously walk around the land, returning to inform their less mobile kin about what's going on. This information might be recieved as something important or just as entertainment.
Altogether I think this view on elves opens up for possibilities.
As a big fan of the Culture novels, this sounds awesome to me. :)
Don’t know the books but the approach sounds very interesting!
I have a really hard time reading fiction, don't know why, don't have a problem reading rpg's
Wish reading fiction would be easier, just gonna have to wait for the movie lol