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Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Wed 18 Oct 2017, 10:41
by negromaestro
There is another thread on half-races, will they be mostly humans mixed with another race?

The common tropes are usually:

half-elves (human and elf)
half-orc (human and orc)
half-ogre (human and ogre)

But shall we have
half-elf-orc (orc and elf, though in Tolkein's mythos, orcs are just corrupted elves, right?)

Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Wed 18 Oct 2017, 10:56
by 9littlebees
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/11 ... ts/2003871
Choose you kin. In Forbidden Lands, you can play human, elf, dwarf, halfling or wargfolk, and probably orc too (we have some differing opinions on this internally!). Each kin will come with its own special talent, somewhat similar to icon talents in Coriolis but powered by Willpower Points that are a acquired by pushing dice rolls in a similar fashion to Mutation Points in Mutant: Year Zero.
Not sure what the latest on orcs are, but I seem to recall that they were leaning more on leaving them out of the core book, possibly to show up in a later supplement.

Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Wed 18 Oct 2017, 11:05
by Brior
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/11 ... ts/2003871
Choose you kin. In Forbidden Lands, you can play human, elf, dwarf, halfling or wargfolk, and probably orc too (we have some differing opinions on this internally!). Each kin will come with its own special talent, somewhat similar to icon talents in Coriolis but powered by Willpower Points that are a acquired by pushing dice rolls in a similar fashion to Mutation Points in Mutant: Year Zero.
Not sure what the latest on orcs are, but I seem to recall that they were leaning more on leaving them out of the core book, possibly to show up in a later supplement.
Let me say that there is more to say about this, but that I'll withhold it for now, pending decisions. Don't let that stop you from speculating though ;-).

Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Wed 18 Oct 2017, 11:16
by 9littlebees
Let me say that there is more to say about this, but that I'll withhold it for now, pending decisions. Don't let that stop you from speculating though ;-).
Ha, indeed!  :D

Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Wed 18 Oct 2017, 15:14
by negromaestro
Okay, so if orcs eventually become a playable race in Forbidden Lands, will they have mostly allied relations with the other Player races of humans, elves, dwarves or would it be only a few outcast orcs friendly within a Player adventuring party, but with the majority of the orcs still serving in the role of antagonists to the Players?

Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Wed 18 Oct 2017, 15:38
by Brior
Okay, so if orcs eventually become a playable race in Forbidden Lands, will they have mostly allied relations with the other Player races of humans, elves, dwarves or would it be only a few outcast orcs friendly within a Player adventuring party, but with the majority of the orcs still serving in the role of antagonists to the Players?
Whether they are playable or not, there will be different clans of orcs as well as outcasts and these will have different views, ranging from ”we will exterminate everybody else” to ”we're determined to defend our place among other peoples and will consider diplomatic contacts”. The intention is that a player should be able to pick a background and view as he/she pleases. There's infighting among all the peoples to allow this. So the view of orcs among for instance elves will vary too, from blatantly racist superiority to ”we owe them a chance”. Also, player characters will be able to side with different parties in conflicts, ending up as buddies with the ones they would otherwise fight. Nothing is carved in stone. (”HA – you ignorant surface maggot!”, says the dwarves”)
This said, some attitudes are more common, but they may change.

Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Wed 18 Oct 2017, 16:56
by negromaestro
Okay, so if orcs eventually become a playable race in Forbidden Lands, will they have mostly allied relations with the other Player races of humans, elves, dwarves or would it be only a few outcast orcs friendly within a Player adventuring party, but with the majority of the orcs still serving in the role of antagonists to the Players?
Whether they are playable or not, there will be different clans of orcs as well as outcasts and these will have different views, ranging from ”we will exterminate everybody else” to ”we're determined to defend our place among other peoples and will consider diplomatic contacts”. The intention is that a player should be able to pick a background and view as he/she pleases. There's infighting among all the peoples to allow this. So the view of orcs among for instance elves will vary too, from blatantly racist superiority to ”we owe them a chance”. Also, player characters will be able to side with different parties in conflicts, ending up as buddies with the ones they would otherwise fight. Nothing is carved in stone. (”HA – you ignorant surface maggot!”, says the dwarves”)
This said, some attitudes are more common, but they may change.
I really like this idea. No default racial enemies, but tribes of clans across all the races, like in that badly panned Warcraft movie, where one of the orish clans (the Frostwolves led by Durotan) sides with the humans against the obviously evil orcish clans (led by Chief Blackhand) and their secret evil human wizard.

Mind you though, in that Warcraft movie, the good orcish clan were still outcasts from their bigger orc tribe.

Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Wed 18 Oct 2017, 17:16
by Brior
I really like this idea. No default racial enemies, but tribes of clans across all the races, like in that badly panned Warcraft movie, where one of the orish clans (the Frostwolves led by Durotan) sides with the humans against the obviously evil orcish clans (led by Chief Blackhand) and their secret evil human wizard.

Mind you though, in that Warcraft movie, the good orcish clan were still outcasts from their bigger orc tribe.
That's basically it (haven't seen the movie though). I personally don't find the preset good-evil duality that interesting. There are historical enmities in Ravenland for sure, but also possibilities to overcome these.

Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Mon 23 Oct 2017, 03:57
by JargogleBamboozle
I have to say that a) I love the fact that none of the kin are inherently good/evil, and b) that the dwarves have a very nice link to the Poetic Edda in terms of their ancestors being somewhat "maggot-like". In fact, that may be the best approach to take for all of the kin: take heavy inspiration from the original Scandinavian and Germanic mythologies.

For example, perhaps the dwarves call their maggot-like ancestors "svartalfar" in reference to them dwelling within the deeper, darker bowels of the earth? Or perhaps the dwarves refer to themselves as "svartalfar" or "dokkalfar" because they emerged from the deeper dark, or perhaps have darker skin themselves that distinguishes them from their pallid forebears?

Similarly, you could draw upon the svartalfar/liosalfar for elves, but rather than have them being dualistic good/light vs dark/evil (which obviously opens up some real cans of worms these days), have them be two separate tribes allied with the day/light and moon/night respectively. They share common outlooks, but the former have light hair/skin and are most active during the day, while the latter have dark skin/hair and are more active by night. That would also step away from the "dark-skinned elves = evil drow" trope. Plus it would permit folks who want to play dark-skinned elves an obvious route to do so while avoiding the whole, "I am a special and unique snowflake Drizzt clone" element.
It could even be tied into their society; perhaps the elves are always ruled by a pair of monarchs, one from each tribe, or maybe the liosalfar rule during spring and summer and the svartalfar during autumn and winter, for instance. It certainly also aligns somewhat with the Celtic seelie/unseelie split of faerie mythology.

Re: Peoples and clans

Posted: Mon 23 Oct 2017, 08:21
by 9littlebees
I have to say that a) I love the fact that none of the kin are inherently good/evil, and b) that the dwarves have a very nice link to the Poetic Edda in terms of their ancestors being somewhat "maggot-like". In fact, that may be the best approach to take for all of the kin: take heavy inspiration from the original Scandinavian and Germanic mythologies.

For example, perhaps the dwarves call their maggot-like ancestors "svartalfar" in reference to them dwelling within the deeper, darker bowels of the earth? Or perhaps the dwarves refer to themselves as "svartalfar" or "dokkalfar" because they emerged from the deeper dark, or perhaps have darker skin themselves that distinguishes them from their pallid forebears?

Similarly, you could draw upon the svartalfar/liosalfar for elves, but rather than have them being dualistic good/light vs dark/evil (which obviously opens up some real cans of worms these days), have them be two separate tribes allied with the day/light and moon/night respectively. They share common outlooks, but the former have light hair/skin and are most active during the day, while the latter have dark skin/hair and are more active by night. That would also step away from the "dark-skinned elves = evil drow" trope. Plus it would permit folks who want to play dark-skinned elves an obvious route to do so while avoiding the whole, "I am a special and unique snowflake Drizzt clone" element.
It could even be tied into their society; perhaps the elves are always ruled by a pair of monarchs, one from each tribe, or maybe the liosalfar rule during spring and summer and the svartalfar during autumn and winter, for instance. It certainly also aligns somewhat with the Celtic seelie/unseelie split of faerie mythology.
I really like these ideas, but would suggest flipping the elf concepts. Dark-skinned elves are the ones who love the sun, pale elves are the moon worshippers. Basically elves have very sensitive skin. So you also have every skin shade in-between, based on how much time they spend in the sunlight.