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lupex
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Thu 19 Sep 2019, 10:10

The items carried in backpack/knapsack should count towards the 2 x str lines.
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Fenhorn
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Thu 19 Sep 2019, 10:58

You can carry Strength x 2 items, but that doesn't say anything about how you are carrying things. Here is where the backpack comes in. It doesn't let you carry more items, but it let you carry items in a more convenient way.

An example
Let assume that you (Hunter, Str 3) have the following items:
Simple Clothes 0 (worn)
Knapsack (another word for backpack) 0 (on your back)
Waterskin 0 (slinged or in your backpack)
Quiver 0 (slinged)
* Short bow ½ (slinged)
* Knife ½ (in your belt)
* D10 Arrows 1 (in a quiver)
* Blanket ½ (attached to backpack)
* Snares ½ (backpack)
* Torches D6 1 (backpack)
* Flint and Steel 0 (backpack)
* Water D8 1 (waterskin)
* Food D8 1 (backpack)
* Some coins 0 (purse, included in simple clothes above)

When it comes to strength, this character can carry all the items, but without a backpack, not in a convenient way. His blanket, his snares, the torches, the food all needs to be carried somehow.  Without a backpack, he could carry it in his hands of course, but that doesn't seem like a very comfortable way of travel. Thanks to that he has a backpack, he can walk all day with his hands free.

or what if you found 500 coins (yes I know that is a little bit much what you normally can find). That probably would count as an heavy item. That means that it has an encumbrance of two, something that most character can carry. But 500 coins is not easy to carry, would fit in your purse, but if you have a sack, then you could carry it.
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MegaMagus
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Thu 19 Sep 2019, 14:53

Thanks for all the replies everyone, I agree with Fenhorn.

All items you carry that are small, medium or heavy, aswell as food, water, torches and arrows are listed and counted in your gear section on your character sheet, where you can carry a maximum of Strengthx2 rows. EVERYTHING should be listed here unless it is tiny/does not encumber. Things such as weapons and armour need to be listed here aswell as on the weapon or armor section in your sheet, which are just useful for looking at what you care about in combat.

The Waterskin, Quiver, Sack and Backpack are how it is assumed you carry your water, arrows, food and all other gear respectively (Maybe torches wouldn't go in a backpack, that's oily and gross). These gear items have no meaning other than for that assumption, to help explain how the adventurers are carrying all this stuff. It could be useful if adventurers lose their waterskin or quiver etc and thus lose all their consumable of that type, other than this, no real meaning/purpose.

What is important is that the consumables themselves take a slot on your gear list. 1 for water, 1 for food etc, regardless of how large your resource die, as long as you have SOME food/water/arrows, that is one whole slot gone for each. 

tl:dr; Consumables take a slot each, the containers they are in do not.
 
MegaMagus
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Mon 30 Sep 2019, 09:01

I was just reading the new Legends and Adventurers PDF with the updated formative events that give you starting items. I saw here that in one of the options for druids, you start with a waterskin but the other options do not give you one.

I had previously assumed that everyone starts the game with a waterskin (You start the game with a particular water resource die so you must have some means of carrying water). This clear distinction makes me rethink that.

Does a waterskin let you carry an extra unit of water? Do players not start with water unless they buy a waterskin? My confusion continues
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Mon 30 Sep 2019, 09:17

I was just reading the new Legends and Adventurers PDF with the updated formative events that give you starting items. I saw here that in one of the options for druids, you start with a waterskin but the other options do not give you one.

I had previously assumed that everyone starts the game with a waterskin (You start the game with a particular water resource die so you must have some means of carrying water). This clear distinction makes me rethink that.

Does a waterskin let you carry an extra unit of water? Do players not start with water unless they buy a waterskin? My confusion continues
We rule that each waterskin with water (or whatever fluid) weigh 1 (and can take a resource dice of water).
“I’d say thistles, but nobody listens to me, anyway.” - Eeyore
 
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hperantunes
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Mon 30 Sep 2019, 14:21

Does a waterskin let you carry an extra unit of water? Do players not start with water unless they buy a waterskin? My confusion continues

I agree that the writing on how consumables, the 4 special containers (knapsack, backpack, waterskin an quiver) and equipment slots work is ambiguous and/or lacking.

My take is the same as Fenhorn's: these special containers don't let a character carry more items than what they're allowed, they're just about how a character is carrying food, torches, water and arrows, respectively.

Additionally, I rule that a character can't carry water without at least one waterskin, or container similarly designed, and I emphatically enforce the rule that says a character can't carry more than d12 of a given resource, no matter how many quivers, backpacks, knapsacks or waterskins they have on them.
 
MegaMagus
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Mon 30 Sep 2019, 15:43

Right, I agree with both of you. How do you rule waterskin acquisition at character creation though? Like I mentioned, I think if you make a character using the Legends/Adventurers book your character will not start with one by default (You are also not told about what resource dice you get, I assumed it would be whatever your class lists, but then why specify that you receive a waterskin?).
If you make a character the normal way, I would assume you get one to carry your water resource die.
 
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Ebrim
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Mon 30 Sep 2019, 16:00

So Legends/Adventures is wonderful in a lot of ways but it's not without some weirdness. Probably from a different stage of game development. For example, if you roll a rider and the steppe nomad formative event you'll get a shortbow but not have the talent to actually use it on horseback.

That all said, starting resources from Legends/Adventures is exactly the same as the profession would give via default character gen. This is in the instructions for using Legends/Adventures on the inside cover I think. Absolutely I'd assume you have a quiver (if you have arrows), waterskin, knapsack, basic clothes and shoes. As for the extra waterskin from Druid, just assume it's an extra waterskin in case your other one is lost or damaged. Perhaps you could also let the player choose another common trade good that is thematically similar.
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Mon 30 Sep 2019, 16:07

... or you can use the extra water skin to carry lamp oil in a convenient way.

edit: or ale or  wine, if you like to ale or wine a lot (easier to carry than in flagons or chalices.
“I’d say thistles, but nobody listens to me, anyway.” - Eeyore
 
MegaMagus
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Re: Waterskin/Quiver/Backpack

Mon 30 Sep 2019, 16:24

Damn alright thanks guys those are good ideas, my head feels much clearer now ;)
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