Alterangel
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Joined: Sun 03 Oct 2021, 21:50

Starter Pre Gen Character Disprepency

Sun 03 Oct 2021, 21:52

Hi there! I just recieved my PDFs for TOR 2nd edition. And I'm super excited! Although I'm trying to learn how to make characters and a discrepancy has emerged! The TNs and Endurance scores for the Pre-Gen Characters in the Starter Set, don't match the rules for established in the Rules pdf.

The TNs are all 2 lower than they should be and the Endurance scores are 2 higher than they should be.

Example: Drogo Baggins has Strength 3, Endurance 23, and TN 15. But according to the rules, the Endurance for Hobbits is Strength + 18 (21), the TN is 20 - Attribute (17).

It is this case with every Pre-Gen character in the Starter Set. The Hope and Parry scores are calculated correctly, but every TN is 2 less than it should be and every Endurance is 2 higher.

What am I missing? Can someone explain this discrepancy? This is my first time playing TOR.
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Starter Pre Gen Character Disprepency

Sun 03 Oct 2021, 21:58

Hi there! I just recieved my PDFs for TOR 2nd edition. And I'm super excited! Although I'm trying to learn how to make characters and a discrepancy has emerged! The TNs and Endurance scores for the Pre-Gen Characters in the Starter Set, don't match the rules for established in the Rules pdf.

The TNs are all 2 lower than they should be and the Endurance scores are 2 higher than they should be.

Example: Drogo Baggins has Strength 3, Endurance 23, and TN 15. But according to the rules, the Endurance for Hobbits is Strength + 18 (21), the TN is 20 - Attribute (17).

It is this case with every Pre-Gen character in the Starter Set. The Hope and Parry scores are calculated correctly, but every TN is 2 less than it should be and every Endurance is 2 higher.

What am I missing? Can someone explain this discrepancy? This is my first time playing TOR.
I don't have the game, so I don't know if it is written anywhere, but they have said that in one-off games (perhaps even shorter campaigns) the TN is better being calculated from 18 instead of 20.
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
 
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Harlath
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Re: Proof reading the new materials?

Sun 03 Oct 2021, 22:18

P17 of the core rules notes using 18 minus attribute for one-offs or shorter games. Great to see the starter set putting this in to action to reduce frustration.
 
Alterangel
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Re: Proof reading the new materials?

Sun 03 Oct 2021, 22:26

Ah I see! Thank you! Although I'm not sure that explains the issue with the Endurance. Why are the Endurance values inflated as well?
 
Otaku-sempai
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Re: Proof reading the new materials?

Mon 04 Oct 2021, 01:00

Another unfortunate, and for newcomers confusing, oversight: The rules always speak of Border Lands for Journey Difficulty, but the hexmap has Free Lands instead and no mention of Border Lands.
.
The way I'm reading this, it is an error. "Border Lands" is an inadvertent carry-over from 1e and should instead be read as "Free Lands". The concept of Border Lands seems to no longer exist in the Journey rules.
.
I see another issue regarding the maps: I know that the hexes on the Loremaster Map are now supposed to represent a distance of approximately 20 miles per hex; however, I can't find anywhere in the text that states this nor is there a scale provided on the map. Was this information omitted or am I just not finding it? There is also no scale provided for the Player's Map, but that might have been intentional.
Last edited by Otaku-sempai on Mon 04 Oct 2021, 06:02, edited 6 times in total.
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Aiden Harrison
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Re: Proof reading the new materials?

Mon 04 Oct 2021, 01:01

I guess they are getting a 'Starter Set' buff to endurance.
 
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mrtoad
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Re: Proof reading the new materials?

Mon 04 Oct 2021, 04:18

Peace and good will to all posters in this thread. Everyone’s entitled to their opinion. My opinion is that if these are ALL the typos, then this is a fantastic job and excellent release. Just speaking generally about life and not about anyone posting, but a person can be so obsessive compulsive about grammar , proofreading, etc that you ruin it for everyone else. I mean, the pdfs are 99.999 percent error free and the few very minor glitches do not significantly impact game play in any way. I pre ordered the Aliens RPG and it was the same vibe on these forums then — 5 very minor typos in that game led to these types of ‘doom and gloom’ posts. I’d encourage everyone to keep calm and carry on, you’re entitled to your opinions but not to blowing them out of proportion due to OCD or just hating on the game or FL. A little perspective and common sense is in order. And again, peace and good will to all, this is not directed to anyone individually but rather an overall spirit of ‘OCD-based hate’ I’ve seen throughout my life.
 
Niallism
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Re: Proof reading the new materials?

Mon 04 Oct 2021, 14:04

Peace and good will to all posters in this thread. Everyone’s entitled to their opinion. My opinion is that if these are ALL the typos, then this is a fantastic job and excellent release. Just speaking generally about life and not about anyone posting, but a person can be so obsessive compulsive about grammar , proofreading, etc that you ruin it for everyone else. I mean, the pdfs are 99.999 percent error free and the few very minor glitches do not significantly impact game play in any way. I pre ordered the Aliens RPG and it was the same vibe on these forums then — 5 very minor typos in that game led to these types of ‘doom and gloom’ posts. I’d encourage everyone to keep calm and carry on, you’re entitled to your opinions but not to blowing them out of proportion due to OCD or just hating on the game or FL. A little perspective and common sense is in order. And again, peace and good will to all, this is not directed to anyone individually but rather an overall spirit of ‘OCD-based hate’ I’ve seen throughout my life.


There is no hate here, and many of these mistakes are confusing and make the rules of the game unclear. I'm sure the publishers will address them in an FAQ at some point, and wish they had noticed them themselves already. I know I would be kicking myself at some of these mistakes, as writing is a big part of my job. This thread helps the creators of the game. It does not attack them in any way.

Your post would be the first seriously negative note I see here, as it's quite passive-aggressive. I think everyone I've seen in this thread has perspective, no hate, nor any signs of OCD - which by the way is a serious mental health problem, not just being pedantic or anal retentive.
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Proof reading the new materials?

Mon 04 Oct 2021, 14:24

Moderator Message: If you want to report various typos and errata that you have found, please do so as clean as possible and don't debate about it. Such discussions will only clutter down the thread (more than it already is cluttered down). Also, if you need clarification about a how a rule work, open a new thread about it so it will be easier to read. Thanks.
edit: This thread started more as a discussion thread that as an errata thread so it is not strange that it continued that way. An errata thread should be clean from discussion, perhaps something for the future.
“Thanks for noticin' me.” - Eeyore
 
tolKeen
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Re: Proof reading the new materials?

Mon 04 Oct 2021, 19:49

I see another issue regarding the maps: I know that the hexes on the Loremaster Map are now supposed to represent a distance of approximately 20 miles per hex; however, I can't find anywhere in the text that states this nor is there a scale provided on the map. Was this information omitted or am I just not finding it? There is also no scale provided for the Player's Map, but that might have been intentional.
Trying to wrap my head around this also. As the Shire pdf on hobbit walking journeys makes a distinction of journeys longer than 50 miles. Not sure how to know one way or the other.

I do notice on p. 9 of the Shire, they say the distance from Michael delving to the Brandywine Bridge is about 40 leagues. And I notice it’s about 4 hexes inthe map. So is every hex 10 leagues? And a league is ~3 miles. So every hex is 30 miles?

This doesn’t seem to agree very well with journey progress being 1 hex per day, or 2 at a forced march or on horses.

Also doesn’t seem to agree with on that same page the statement that a hobbit could walk from one need to the other of the East Road in about a week, walking 12 mi a day.

Help? Is there a more obvious/easier way of making a rule of thumb for this?

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