baldrick0712
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Re: Reliability of weapons.

Tue 30 Nov 2021, 19:13

As I understand it, when a weapon reaches REL 0, it cannot be used any more before it's fixed.
It's not a jam or that something like that. It's simply broken.
Correct. I thought though that that was the complaint - i.e. weapons don't just become paperweights if they go wrong; something less catastrophic occurs like it starts misfeeding more regularly etc.
 
Oddball_E8
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Re: Reliability of weapons.

Tue 30 Nov 2021, 21:15

As I understand it, when a weapon reaches REL 0, it cannot be used any more before it's fixed.
It's not a jam or that something like that. It's simply broken.
Correct. I thought though that that was the complaint - i.e. weapons don't just become paperweights if they go wrong; something less catastrophic occurs like it starts misfeeding more regularly etc.
One could implement some rule that states that the lower a weapons reliability is at the time (ie. if it's at 3 out of 5, etc.) then it's more likely to have a mishap, I suppose.

But the way REL is written in the game, it really is to represent when a weapon is as good as a paperweight. Because that's when you've worn down the weapon to the degree of it simply not working any more.

I suppose you could write a critical damage list for weapons when they reach 0 in REL, but it wouldn't be something where the weapon keeps working but at a diminished capacity (other than to use as a club), but rather what the final "nail in the coffin" problem is for the weapon.
BUT, that would also include pretty narly stuff that isn't really fixable with "one spare part and some tools", like a barrel explosion from a squib, out of battery detonation or headspacing issues.

Either way, the way REL is supposed to work, when it reaches 0 the game is literally unusable as a firearm until it is fixed.
It's not gonna just jam or have its magazine drop out unexpectedly.
It is gone, kaputt, fubar, non-functional.

Technically, though, a REL zero situation shouldn't happen with any weapon in-game as long as they're well kept and maintained.
But that's easier said than done sometimes, especially if the players are civilians.
But statistically, getting a REL zero situation in one go from a weapon that's at REL 5 to start with is pretty unlikely.
You'd have to be using a weapon with a high ROF and rolling a toooon of ones on your ammo rolls.
 
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ottarrus
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Re: Reliability of weapons.

Wed 01 Dec 2021, 19:52

I think we're all confusing 'reliability' with 'quality' here.

An overused and under-maintained weapon will often fire reliably, but if the lands and grooves of the barrel are shot out and the gas seals are half rotten, it won't the broad side of a pregnant barn.
The rules say that after weapons are fired they need 'a stretch of maintenance' to keep their reliability. OK that's fine to an extent.

But a lot of things will degrade that quality over time. Things like:
- Quality of ammo; IIRC, Krakow can reload your brass... with black powder not nitrocellulose smokeless powder. HUGE difference there. Black powder doesn't burn as evenly or as hot as smokeless powder, so it's ballistically very inconsistent. While you can clean a weapon firing black powder with hot water [instead of solvent] if you don't clean and oil daily, the powder residue can get very acidic very quickly.
- Quality of cleaning tools; You can clean a rifle with paint thinner, but it's not gonna do anything like as good a job as Hoppe's #9. You can lube a weapon with motor oil, but it's gonna get sticky and tacky very quickly and draw dirt like a magnet. And that's not even getting into the brushes. And when was the last time somebody in T2K saw a pipe cleaner? I figure that by now everyone is cleaning gas tubes with dental tools.

And all of this is really over-detailed and kind of ticky-tack. Getting to this level of 'authenticity' would rapidly slow a game down to a glacial pace... especially if you start doing it with vehicles! The game rules of 'a stretch of maintenance' isn't too much big a hand wave here, I think.

Of course, the weapons picked up from marauders and militia SHOULD be of varying quality... nothing wrong with a some raider weapon being REL: 3 because they haven't had the discipline or supplies to properly care for them.
 
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Higgipedia
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Re: Reliability of weapons.

Thu 02 Dec 2021, 06:21

What Ursus said. I had an A1 at OSUT in '93 and again in the Guard in '99.
Heh. They had a few A1s kicking around the Defense Language Institute in 2006.
DENNIS HIGGINS
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Ursus Maior
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Re: Reliability of weapons.

Sun 05 Dec 2021, 23:58

Technically, though, a REL zero situation shouldn't happen with any weapon in-game as long as they're well kept and maintained.
Technically, yes. Though, if you push a roll while using full ROF 6, REL can drop fast. If this happens early in a firefight, you have to choose, whether to fire the weapon only safely or risk it.
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