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ottarrus
Posts: 192
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Re: Should there be more weapons with picatinny rails?

Sat 27 Nov 2021, 05:54

Thanks for all the input, guys.

I'll be running it this way (Swedish campaign):

For the US; Only SF will have gotten weapons with rails and such (essentially what I've been staring at in those pics from 2001). The vast amount of line soldiers just had the "good ol' stuff".
For the USSR: No rails whatsoever, but Spetsnaz and such would have more N and M models of the AK, with options to mount their side mounted optics.
For Sweden: The AK-5C has been rushed into production due to not having budget cuts in the 90's, but it hasn't reached front lines really, but rather goes to the more "elite" units like Jägare and Specialförband.

In other words, the weapons *are* out there, but few and far between in working condition.
Of course, weapons like these would be prized possessions for anyone, so not only special units have them now, but rather whomever happens to have acquired one over the years (either from dead enemies, prisoners or from fallen comrades or just random corpses).

EDIT: As an added bonus for this, It'll be semi-easy for my players (all non military nerds) to spot soviet special forces due to them being the only ones using the newer black polymer furniture AK-74M's (not all of them have them, but they're the only ones who have them, essentially, in my game).

I would suggest that the weapons themselves aren't such a big deal, but the MODS would be... flashlight mounts can be jimmy-rigged with baling wire, but laser pointers and ACOG sights? Yeah, those would be worth quite a bit.
Since you're using Sweden as your setting, and since Sweden is off the beaten path, I would respectfully suggest that you read up on USMC Force Recon. Most of the Special Operators in 2nd MARDIV will come from there, rather than the SEALS. You could also say that an Army Special Forces Group is in the neighborhood... resistance warfare is right up their alley. I suggest that the 12th SFG[A] would be the logical choice. This was an Army Reserve Group similar to the 11th SFG[A] in the Ref's Book that consisted of retreads and part-timers that was oriented towards Europe in the 80s and '90s.
 
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omnipus
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Re: Should there be more weapons with picatinny rails?

Sat 27 Nov 2021, 19:39

EDIT: As an added bonus for this, It'll be semi-easy for my players (all non military nerds) to spot soviet special forces due to them being the only ones using the newer black polymer furniture AK-74M's (not all of them have them, but they're the only ones who have them, essentially, in my game).
Nothing terribly wrong with that if that's how you want to do it, but many Spetsnaz operators have tended to resist the AK-74 in general, preferring to keep to either specialty weapons (like the VAL and its successors) or just stick with the old AKM (with higher stopping power, penetration, and greater availability of suppressors). I don't know who would have received the 74Ms first, but my guess would be GRU units and VDV, but it's very hard to say.
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Higgipedia
Posts: 29
Joined: Fri 27 Nov 2020, 05:43

Re: Should there be more weapons with picatinny rails?

Thu 02 Dec 2021, 06:10

Since you're using Sweden as your setting, and since Sweden is off the beaten path, I would respectfully suggest that you read up on USMC Force Recon. Most of the Special Operators in 2nd MARDIV will come from there, rather than the SEALS. You could also say that an Army Special Forces Group is in the neighborhood... resistance warfare is right up their alley. I suggest that the 12th SFG[A] would be the logical choice. This was an Army Reserve Group similar to the 11th SFG[A] in the Ref's Book that consisted of retreads and part-timers that was oriented towards Europe in the 80s and '90s.
I believe the intent was that 11th Group was wherever the campaign was, since it was in the "General" portion of the Factions and Forces chapter.

I will submit that it wasn't until a few years into the GWOT that the Marines started to operate under the umbrella of USSOCOM. Force Recon (and, to a lesser extent, 2nd Reconnaissance Battalion) would be used there but probably not as the SOCEUR assets. SOCEUR has organically, 1st Battalion, 10th Special Forces Group and Naval Special Warfare Unit 2. They would use them for very different things. 1/10 would be conducting Unconventional Warfare against the Soviets and NSWU 2 would be conducting Direct Action and Special Reconnaissance missions. I am sure that SOCEUR would be enhanced (likely by the rest of 10th Group coming from, at the time, Fort Devens, as well as 11th Group from the Reserves and 19th Group from the National Guard) and I'm not sure what else would be added from Naval Special Warfare. It's also unclear how JSOC (who operates outside of both USSOCOM and Land Forces Command) fits into things.

Given the (at the time) frosty relationship between Force Recon and SOCOM units, I could totally see them operating at cross-purposes. It could be a fun twist to put into your games.
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paladin2019
Posts: 432
Joined: Mon 07 Dec 2020, 09:16

Re: Should there be more weapons with picatinny rails?

Thu 02 Dec 2021, 06:57

The game doesn't care about designations and organizations, only capabilities. Force Reconnaissance Marines are modeled by the special operations branch in the rulebook regardless of who they answer to.
 
Oddball_E8
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Re: Should there be more weapons with picatinny rails?

Fri 03 Dec 2021, 19:01

EDIT: As an added bonus for this, It'll be semi-easy for my players (all non military nerds) to spot soviet special forces due to them being the only ones using the newer black polymer furniture AK-74M's (not all of them have them, but they're the only ones who have them, essentially, in my game).
Nothing terribly wrong with that if that's how you want to do it, but many Spetsnaz operators have tended to resist the AK-74 in general, preferring to keep to either specialty weapons (like the VAL and its successors) or just stick with the old AKM (with higher stopping power, penetration, and greater availability of suppressors). I don't know who would have received the 74Ms first, but my guess would be GRU units and VDV, but it's very hard to say.
Huh, didn't know that.

Oh well, I guess having them as sort of "identifiers" for GRU and VDV would be fine too.
AS VAL and the like isn't listed in the book at all, though.

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