Sure, but that stuff is all absolute highest priority for any soldier, right along with their rifle. It is the difference between life and death in the real world, at least when the weather turns colder. And in the meantime there is rain, which poses a lot of hazards itself.The impression I've got so far is that this all takes place after the PC's have been through more than their fair share of shit and would have lost a decent part of their original (military) kit.True, there's a real lack of basic field supply in all of the starting loads: sleeping bags, compasses, shelter halves, shovels. These things mostly all exist in the game but without some digging you wouldn't know it! However I think the travel/survival rules in general are pretty lenient even to the point that they must assume you won't have them.
Re: Player Starting Money
Author, Central Poland Sourcebook -- now available on DriveThruRPG
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- paladin2019
- Posts: 438
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Re: Player Starting Money
The problems with this interpretation are 1) a lot of first line kit is missing, 2) second line kit is very well defined, and 3) third line kit, your rucksack, is still very present. If you have the second and part of the third, how is the first missing? It's the last thing you take off! Unless compasses, for example, are an assumed gear item and covered in the normal chances for navigation; lack of one would be a -1 or -2 rather than improving chances.The impression I've got so far is that this all takes place after the PC's have been through more than their fair share of shit and would have lost a decent part of their original (military) kit.True, there's a real lack of basic field supply in all of the starting loads: sleeping bags, compasses, shelter halves, shovels. These things mostly all exist in the game but without some digging you wouldn't know it! However I think the travel/survival rules in general are pretty lenient even to the point that they must assume you won't have them.
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- starkillerbh
- Posts: 27
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Re: Player Starting Money
I am playing the Sgt that taught me to play in Okinawa in the 80s and in no way would Marines at the very least, be missing all of their basic supply items issued to EVERYONE. Only if they were somehow captured first.
We are expanding the initial gear list.
If you have a rifle you have a bayonet.
Everyone has a sleeping bag.
Since you get 3 rations of water that means you have 3 canteens instead of the normal 2 issued.
Everyone has a poncho for rain gear.
Everyone has 3 sets of fatigues, standard issue.
Since it is Europe everyone has a cold weather coat as well.
I forgot about E-tool which we will add as well. Marines have used them to fight with many times when running out of ammo over the 20th century.
Everyone also has a gas mask, MOPP is not always standard issue but it was in Desert Storm. Gas masks are always standard issue though.
Everyone has a flashlight with red, blue and clear lenses.
Everyone has a backpack.
Everyone with a rifle has 2 ammo pouches with a total of 7 magazines, 1 inserted in weapon 6 in the 2 pouches. If you want to say they have lost some in combat that is on you. Most Marines unless in full retreat in a massive fire fight would not leave their empty magazines behind.
Side arms have a standard 3 magazines, 2 in a pouch 1 in weapon.
Web gear is standard issue for carrying canteens, ammo pouches, E-tool and Gas mask.
We are expanding the initial gear list.
If you have a rifle you have a bayonet.
Everyone has a sleeping bag.
Since you get 3 rations of water that means you have 3 canteens instead of the normal 2 issued.
Everyone has a poncho for rain gear.
Everyone has 3 sets of fatigues, standard issue.
Since it is Europe everyone has a cold weather coat as well.
I forgot about E-tool which we will add as well. Marines have used them to fight with many times when running out of ammo over the 20th century.
Everyone also has a gas mask, MOPP is not always standard issue but it was in Desert Storm. Gas masks are always standard issue though.
Everyone has a flashlight with red, blue and clear lenses.
Everyone has a backpack.
Everyone with a rifle has 2 ammo pouches with a total of 7 magazines, 1 inserted in weapon 6 in the 2 pouches. If you want to say they have lost some in combat that is on you. Most Marines unless in full retreat in a massive fire fight would not leave their empty magazines behind.
Side arms have a standard 3 magazines, 2 in a pouch 1 in weapon.
Web gear is standard issue for carrying canteens, ammo pouches, E-tool and Gas mask.
Re: Player Starting Money
I am playing the Sgt that taught me to play in Okinawa in the 80s and in no way would Marines at the very least, be missing all of their basic supply items issued to EVERYONE. Only if they were somehow captured first.
We are expanding the initial gear list.
If you have a rifle you have a bayonet.
Everyone has a sleeping bag.
Since you get 3 rations of water that means you have 3 canteens instead of the normal 2 issued.
Everyone has a poncho for rain gear.
Everyone has 3 sets of fatigues, standard issue.
Since it is Europe everyone has a cold weather coat as well.
I forgot about E-tool which we will add as well. Marines have used them to fight with many times when running out of ammo over the 20th century.
Everyone also has a gas mask, MOPP is not always standard issue but it was in Desert Storm. Gas masks are always standard issue though.
Everyone has a flashlight with red, blue and clear lenses.
Everyone has a backpack.
Everyone with a rifle has 2 ammo pouches with a total of 7 magazines, 1 inserted in weapon 6 in the 2 pouches. If you want to say they have lost some in combat that is on you. Most Marines unless in full retreat in a massive fire fight would not leave their empty magazines behind.
Side arms have a standard 3 magazines, 2 in a pouch 1 in weapon.
Web gear is standard issue for carrying canteens, ammo pouches, E-tool and Gas mask.
Thanks a lot for your information, I'll be using this
/Makhfi
Re: Player Starting Money
After some 3 years of war and probably a couple of years of almost no proper CSS, I can see how a lot of these things could have been broken or lost. I agree that things like rain/cold weather gear are vital enough to make sure they're present and usable. Same with e-tool and gas mask, though I can see the mask being damaged during the 3 years or the filter being saturated or waterlogged. However lugging 2 extra sets of fatigues instead of extra food/water/ammo seems really odd to me. Small stuff light flashlights can be lost or broken. The most common case I recall is when you camp and pack up in dark, sometimes something just falls out of your pouch and you don't see it. Yes, in an ideal world it wouldn't happen, but in real life it does. Similarly you might be unpacked, having a food break or something and there's an enemy contact. You will most likely leave your canteen or backpack instead of risking with your life. Add all these complications and no support/low supply stocks and multiply it by three years of war and you don't have all those "fresh out of the warehouse" kits anymore.I am playing the Sgt that taught me to play in Okinawa in the 80s and in no way would Marines at the very least, be missing all of their basic supply items issued to EVERYONE. Only if they were somehow captured first.
Not saying you can't do it for your game, just that the way the world of T2K is presented, I doubt anyone would have all of their issued kit anymore.
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- cheeplives
- Posts: 107
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Re: Player Starting Money
Another option is that you could also take the list provided by Makhfi and have the player make a CUF roll for each item on the list to see what, if anything, they've lost in the intervening time from getrting off the boat in Europe to the current situation.
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- Oddball_E8
- Posts: 447
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Re: Player Starting Money
Lost over time? Worn out or broken?The problems with this interpretation are 1) a lot of first line kit is missing, 2) second line kit is very well defined, and 3) third line kit, your rucksack, is still very present. If you have the second and part of the third, how is the first missing? It's the last thing you take off! Unless compasses, for example, are an assumed gear item and covered in the normal chances for navigation; lack of one would be a -1 or -2 rather than improving chances.The impression I've got so far is that this all takes place after the PC's have been through more than their fair share of shit and would have lost a decent part of their original (military) kit.True, there's a real lack of basic field supply in all of the starting loads: sleeping bags, compasses, shelter halves, shovels. These things mostly all exist in the game but without some digging you wouldn't know it! However I think the travel/survival rules in general are pretty lenient even to the point that they must assume you won't have them.
I mean, the game doesn't start the day after Operation Reset, AFAIK.
This is basically whatever the players have scrounged up in the retreat and fractioning after the chaotic battle and during the days or weeks there after.
Re: Player Starting Money
I can see not giving PC's a whole lot of 'money' to stock up with. One of the big problems with earlier versions of T2K was the HUGE amount of crap players bought... stuff they had no Earthly reason to have as enlisted US Army soldiers [one guy in a campaign I played in had a radio and encryption set we both knew was only ever issued to SOF units - - the character was an NBC NCO]. And remember that if they were playing East Bloc soldiers, there was much LESS opportunity to get high speed - low drag gear. And the idea that private troops are running around with 1 oz. Krugerrand's in their pockets? Fuggettabatit!
Very few referees reeled in the players as to what was reasonable and what wasn't.
AFAIC, 'special gear' ought to be a negotiation between player and referee. The whole idea of the milieu is that there shouldn't be player characters running around with unopened cases of ammo in their personal stash. Scarcity is the whole point of this.
Very few referees reeled in the players as to what was reasonable and what wasn't.
AFAIC, 'special gear' ought to be a negotiation between player and referee. The whole idea of the milieu is that there shouldn't be player characters running around with unopened cases of ammo in their personal stash. Scarcity is the whole point of this.
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- paladin2019
- Posts: 438
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Re: Player Starting Money
Radio models aren't specified in earlier versions. Nor is specificity in the support branch; the PC was an NBC NCO because the player defined them that way. They could just as easily been a radio repairman or a crypto/intercept guy or the like. And the limit is what fits on your back and in your truck. That's where the limits aren't being enforced.I can see not giving PC's a whole lot of 'money' to stock up with. One of the big problems with earlier versions of T2K was the HUGE amount of crap players bought... stuff they had no Earthly reason to have as enlisted US Army soldiers [one guy in a campaign I played in had a radio and encryption set we both knew was only ever issued to SOF units - - the character was an NBC NCO]. And remember that if they were playing East Bloc soldiers, there was much LESS opportunity to get high speed - low drag gear. And the idea that private troops are running around with 1 oz. Krugerrand's in their pockets? Fuggettabatit!
Very few referees reeled in the players as to what was reasonable and what wasn't.
This is not a true statement. It's an interpretation this version leans into. Previous versions were based on being well-supplied and whittling all that down with no resupply. They were about resource management, not resource nonavailability.The whole idea of the milieu is that there shouldn't be player characters running around with unopened cases of ammo in their personal stash. Scarcity is the whole point of this.
Re: Player Starting Money
Straightforward solution to that, if GM fiat/common sense doesn't work: roll the item's availability like you would otherwise!
What I tend to do though is offer some sort of thematic compromise: oh, you want an encrypted radio set? Yeah, ok, you saw one of those left behind when you were bugging out. Only thing is it took a bullet through the face. Maybe you can fix it later.
What I tend to do though is offer some sort of thematic compromise: oh, you want an encrypted radio set? Yeah, ok, you saw one of those left behind when you were bugging out. Only thing is it took a bullet through the face. Maybe you can fix it later.
Author, Central Poland Sourcebook -- now available on DriveThruRPG
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