Nicolas Michon
Topic Author
Posts: 51
Joined: Sun 06 Sep 2020, 21:18

[ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 01:01

[Cross-posted from FB group]
And now, for something completely different!
Since TW2000 is a survival game, it would be interesting IMHO to expand on the disease section.
To begin with, I have noted ONE clear mistake in the table, regarding rabies (I have noted it in the Dropbox). This viral infection should have its own rules, and the elements listed in the table are, unfortunately, incorrect. Rabies has an incubation period of 30 to 45 days (or maybe 25 days + a stamina roll) if a bite is infected (maybe one could allow an immediate Healing roll, with a strong disinfectant, to avoid that). The disease is ALWAYS fatal if the vaccine is not administered (this requires several injections) before the onset of symptoms, antirabies antibodies can sometimes be injected at the same time to make sure the symptoms do not appear. Finding such a treatment in a war-ravaged country is a scenario goal in and of itself - and, in case of failure, having to put a PC out of his or her misery, as it is a horrible way to go, will be a traumatic event. One may therefore want to have the "rabid dog" encounter changed to "aggressive dog", with the dog only being rabid on a die roll of 6 on a D6.
Some more info on the other diseases would be helpful: for instance, typhus is transmitted to humans by head lice, which means that basic hygiene is important (so washing, finding soap .... good luck guys & gals !). Along the same lines, scabies will be a real problem (the itch is terrible - at least one stress point worth -, and it can get infected), and poor hygiene increases the risk of catching it (the lil' beasties are EXTREMELY contagious by the way). Specialized medicine will be very scarce, and the most common remedy will therefore be ..... white vinegar or a mixture of alcohol and soap (ouch!!!). I haven't done the work for cholera (transmitted by contaminated water), etc., but it would be good to have.
For wound infections, some pointers on gangrene (and the cleaning of wounds) would be good as well. Incidentally, Soviet soldiers carried specialized bacteriophages in their medkits, precisely against gangrene (bacteriophages are virus-eating bacteria - contrary to antibiotics, they don't work against all, but tend to be very effective and there is no resistance).
Other ailments that would be common in the TW 2000 environment (frostbite, trench foot ....) and the ways to prevent them / treat them would be, IMHO, a welcome addition.
Maybe some of it could be advanced / optional rules, but it would definitely belong in the universe.
 
AEB
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat 19 Sep 2020, 06:01

Re: [ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 03:51

I suspect that getting badly wounded or ill is about the worst thing that can happen to you in TW2000.

Have been catching up with old friends. One was badly injured a few years back in a vehicle rollover in Afghanistan. I remember him telling me once he was back in Australia of just how massive the medical system that saved him was.

After the rollover the unit medics spent an hour stabilising him at the scene before a helicopter flew him to the FOB. There they worked on him again in the Aid Post before he was helicoptered to a military hospital at Bagram. After an emergency operation on a crushed leg he was stabilised then flown to Ramstein in Germany where they did reconstructive surgery on his leg. Once he was fit enough to fly he was flown Back to Australia for rehabilitation which took a number of months before he was discharged on medical grounds. He got back around 90% mobility.

In TW you get injured in a firefight. Your buddies throw you in the back of a vehicle (if you are lucky) and while retreating the group medic does what they can with the limited supplies they have on hand. After that you have to survive while you slowly recover with minimal care all while being a burden on your group who may be constantly on the move. Many groups will abandon the badly wounded or sick to assure their own survival, and no one will waste their limited supplies on a badly wounded enemy.

Amputations will become common as the last resort.

Grim times indeed.
 
welsh
Posts: 166
Joined: Sun 29 Nov 2020, 15:53

Re: [ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 04:00

Waterborne diseases will be particularly important. Cholera, giardia, dysentery, typhoid, E. coli, salmonella.

Reality is, you can't tell if water is safe. The PCs would have to boil water. So, I don't think the rules should worry too much about foraging for water; there's lots of water around, and the real work is boiling it.
 
AEB
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat 19 Sep 2020, 06:01

Re: [ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 04:06

The stills used to produce alcohol can also be used to create safe water. Purifying tablets would be highly valued. Alcohol can also be added to water to make it safe (and the drinker merry).
 
Wacsmurf
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed 02 Dec 2020, 03:07

Re: [ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 05:27

One good herbal remedy for colds, fevers and the flu is Russian in origin. It’s a soup made up of 50 cloves of garlic. I was given it when I was a child and it’s very strong.
You might want to have some type of wild craft or apothecary skill available to come up with homeopathic. cures.
 
aspqrz
Posts: 47
Joined: Mon 07 Sep 2020, 12:17
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: [ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 06:57

95% of Rabies deaths occur in Africa and Asia. The UK and Ireland have been Rabies free (of indigenous cases) since the early 20th century.

I'd think that, even with The War, to confirm a Rabies case would be more like rolling a 6 followed by a 6 followed by a 4-6.

Also note that, while quite rare (extremely - exactly one known case, which may not be as definitive as it at first seemed), it *is* possible for someone who has symptomatic Rabies to survive.

Phil McGregor
 
AEB
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat 19 Sep 2020, 06:01

Re: [ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 16:17

To survive Rabies you are put into an induced coma and kept hydrated until the virus runs it course. That will not be available in the TW setting.
 
aspqrz
Posts: 47
Joined: Mon 07 Sep 2020, 12:17
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: [ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Sat 05 Dec 2020, 01:19

To survive Rabies you are put into an induced coma and kept hydrated until the virus runs it course. That will not be available in the TW setting.
And that has worked, possibly, exactly once (at least according to Wikipedia).

The thing is, Rabies, even in a war ravaged Europe, will be extremely rare ... much rarer than things like Cholera, Typhus, Typhoid, Dysentery, Influenza etc. And having a radiation affected immune system will make resistance to these diseases ... less effective.

Phil McGregor
========
Author: Space Opera (FGU); Rigger Black Book #1 (FASA); Orbis Mundi 2, The Marketplace, Ithura & Porthaven, Fantasy Europe (PGD); Road to Armageddon & Supplements, Displaced, Audace ad Gloriam, Farm, Forge & Steam (PGD).
 
AEB
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat 19 Sep 2020, 06:01

Re: [ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Sat 05 Dec 2020, 04:16

In the aftermath of nuclear strikes and a general breakdown of control measures you could see a spike in rabies cases but it would take many years to become anything but a problem in a few isolated areas.

Getting bitten by a dog that may have been feeding on rotting human corpses in a world with very limited antibiotics would be bad enough.

In the world of TW2000 getting rabies - with no anti-rabies shots and no induced comas in hospital available - would be a 100% death sentence.
 
aspqrz
Posts: 47
Joined: Mon 07 Sep 2020, 12:17
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: [ALPHA] Illness (rabies especially), wounds, hygiene, and more fun stuff ....

Sat 05 Dec 2020, 11:44

In TW2000 getting rabies - with no anti-rabies shots and no induced comas in hospital available - would be a 100% death sentence.

Unless you have better information than I have been able to track down, getting Rabies if there is no Rabies vaccine is 100% fatal. All the induced coma does is make your death less unpleasant for you (and, possibly, for those around you).

There is, as far as I am aware, exactly ONE person who has survived Rabies sans vaccine ... and that case is doubtful as, on closer examination, it was shown that the subject had some rabies antibodies already ...

A treatment known as the Milwaukee protocol, which involves putting a person into a chemically induced coma and using antiviral medications, has been proposed but subsequently found not to be useful. It initially came into use in 2003, following Jeanna Giese, a teenager from Wisconsin, becoming the first person known to have survived rabies without preventive treatments before symptom onset. She, however, already had antibodies against rabies when she initially arrived at hospital. While this treatment has been tried multiple times more, there have been no further cases of survival. The protocol has since been assessed as an ineffective treatment with concerns related to the costs and ethics of its use.

Not good survival odds.

Phil McGregor
========
Author: Space Opera (FGU); Rigger Black Book #1 (FASA); Orbis Mundi 2, The Marketplace, Ithura & Porthaven, Fantasy Europe (PGD); Road to Armageddon & Supplements, Displaced, Audace ad Gloriam, Farm, Forge & Steam (PGD).

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