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Vader
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 10:59

Another interesting effect I have big problems with is that you can't fire a burst of two or three shots and still be able to hit your target with two bullets.

In fact, assuming I read the rules right, you must spend a minimum of six shots to be able to hit anything with two bullets!

This seems unreasonable to me. I vividly remember being able to fairly reliably score double hits on "prone" target silhouettes at 15-20m firing three-round bursts from a standing position.
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HorusZA
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 11:24

I always thought that the motivation for adding the three-round burst capability to rifles was to increase the chance to achieve a hit while preventing the spray-and-pray style waste of ammo.
The Ammo Dice right now does nothing to increase the probability of a hit which seems odd, more rounds = more chances that at least one of them will hit.
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 11:46

I always thought that the motivation for adding the three-round burst capability to rifles was to increase the chance to achieve a hit while preventing the spray-and-pray style waste of ammo.
The Ammo Dice right now does nothing to increase the probability of a hit which seems odd, more rounds = more chances that at least one of them will hit.
Each Ammo dice gives a chance for an extra hit, if your base dice succeeds, and if your base dice don't succeeds, then a hit from the ammo dice at least counts as suppressive fire.
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HorusZA
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 11:54

I always thought that the motivation for adding the three-round burst capability to rifles was to increase the chance to achieve a hit while preventing the spray-and-pray style waste of ammo.
The Ammo Dice right now does nothing to increase the probability of a hit which seems odd, more rounds = more chances that at least one of them will hit.
Each Ammo dice gives a chance for an extra hit, if your base dice succeeds, and if your base dice don't succeeds, then a hit from the ammo dice at least counts as suppressive fire.
Yup, more rounds don't do anything to increase your chance to score a hit, which I think they should.
100% agree about suppressive fire... great mechanic!
 
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Fenhorn
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 12:05

I think the idea is that if your attack missed (because target moved slightly or something), your extra burst (i.e. ammo dice) will go the same way and also miss because those bulles go the same way as the first aimed bullets did or even a little bit more off due to some loss of the aim when shooting more bullets (because of many reasons, recoil perhaps).
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pansarskott
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 12:51

Burst fire to increase hit probability was an idea in the G11. 3 round bursts with very high ROF and controlled dispersion. Kind of a shotgun.

Isn't 3-round bursts in assault rifles mostly a way a getting a large part of the suppressive effects of full auto without emptying the magazine in one trigger pull (US lessons from Vietnam)?
 
rennarda
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 13:15

Another interesting effect I have big problems with is that you can't fire a burst of two or three shots and still be able to hit your target with two bullets.

In fact, assuming I read the rules right, you must spend a minimum of six shots to be able to hit anything with two bullets!
This is why I think the number of bullets used and the number of hits achieved should not correlate on the ammo dice. I think this could be solved by altering the way the faces are numbered, but a simple solution would be to roll the ammo dice once to see what hits you get, and then roll them a second time just to calculate how many bullets you used.

Overall though, I would much prefer a design where ammo capacity was given in bursts, and 1 burst = 1 ammo dice, and the ammo dice were just marked with hits or mishaps, not numbers. You don't count individual bullets, just the number of bursts you have. For semi-automatic, we'd assume you're firing multiple shots. For single shot weapons like sniper rifles and bows, you don't use ammo dice and just count individual shots.
 
welsh
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 14:26

Wasn't the "3-round burst shots" 2e? Or am I missing my recollection...
You do ... I checked my memory before bringing it up. :)
 
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Vader
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 16:38

Wasn't the "3-round burst shots" 2e? Or am I missing my recollection...
You do ... I checked my memory before bringing it up. :)

Gotcha! :mrgreen:
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Vader
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Re: Ammo Dice...why?

Fri 04 Dec 2020, 16:41

Burst fire to increase hit probability was an idea in the G11. 3 round bursts with very high ROF and controlled dispersion. Kind of a shotgun.

Isn't 3-round bursts in assault rifles mostly a way a getting a large part of the suppressive effects of full auto without emptying the magazine in one trigger pull (US lessons from Vietnam)?

That's correct.
[i]Before[/i] clicking that response button — [i]are you sure you actually [b]read[/b] it?[/i]

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